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December 28, 2022 12:40 pm  #1


Series Marathons Into The New Year

Christmas into the New Year sees marathons of various programs on some cable channels.  Most of these are 24/7 in free preview and running the series in order from show #1.  A few that I have noticed so far.
.
CTV Life- Blue Bloods
CTV Comedy- Big Bang Theory
CTV Drama-Chicago Fire
E!-Friends
CMT-Cheers

Other networks like Showcase and CTV Sci Fi are showing some excellent movies over the holidays.  In addition  free preview on newer networks like BBC First, Magnolia Network, Museum TV, Love Nature, 101 International.

So many channels and no time to watch them!

 

 

December 28, 2022 12:53 pm  #2


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Those sound good but my favourite year-end marathon tradition is the one we can't get in this country, unfortunately. It's the U.S. SyFy Channel, which for years has shown nearly every Twilight Zone episode ever made - including the rarely seen hour long ones - in a major marathon between early New Year's Eve and all of New Year's Day. 

The other interesting one I'd like to see but can't is what MeTV announced they're doing this year. Their "The First!" is taking an entire day to show the very first episodes or the pilots of some of the greatest TV shows of all time, including The Honeymooners, Gomer Pyle, U.S.M.C., The Andy Griffith Show, Leave It To Beaver and even the M*A*S*H pilot. 

I sure wish that station from the Buffalo area put in a better signal to Toronto!

But the marathons are a classic programming option when viewership is low and they're looking for a reason to get you to tune in. I'm glad some Canadian stations are getting on the bandwagon.

 

December 28, 2022 1:54 pm  #3


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Hahaha..I figured you would chime in with all of the shows you just can't get here since that is all you ever focus on. Cable is hardly getting on the bandwagon, the Christmas-New Years marathons have been going on for years.   And this has been discussed various times here on SOWNY, so you can't use your usual excuse of not having cable. 


 

     Thread Starter
 

December 28, 2022 1:59 pm  #4


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Once again I think you may have completely misinterpreted what I was saying. Or perhaps I didn't say it well enough. I'm not decrying or denigrating Canadian cable. But there are certain marathons I'd love to see and almost 48 hours of The Twilight Zone tops my list. It is has nothing to do with Canada vs. U.S. TV. 

SyFy has the rights down there and has been doing it for years. If someone here did it, too, I'd be applauding. This has nothing to do with one country over another. It's the specific show I'm lamenting missing - not where it runs. 

As for the MeTV thing, I was just congratulating them on thinking outside the box and figuring out a novel way to wring in the New Year, using all the shows they have the rights to. You have to admit it's a clever concept. Again, it has nothing to do with the country - just the idea. Maybe CHCH could consider it for next year. I'd definitely tune in. 

 

December 28, 2022 3:54 pm  #5


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Seems you have changed your tune now.  You referred to Canadian cable channels of getting "on the bandwagon" like series marathons were new here. This is not the case.
 
Marathons have been a staple Christmas-New Years for years and also over long holiday weekends.  I believe Space or CTV Sci-Fi has featured Twilight Zone marathons before. And shows like Leave It To Beaver, Gomer Pyle USMC, MASH, Andy Griffith have already ran various times on CHCH. 

And for you to arrogantly say "once again you have completely misinterpreted what I was saying" is  bogus and a feeble attempt at deflection.  To state that this isn't about comparing TV here vs there is rich.  This is one of your sacred cows that you complain about constantly.  You have said many times how we are penalized because of where we live when a show or channel isn't available here or the rights belong to a different Canadian provider.

The fact that Me TV is running only pilots is interesting and cool, but in reality is a sidebar. It gives you another chance to point out programming you can't get here that you could there.  You do this almost on a daily basis.


 

     Thread Starter
 

December 28, 2022 5:49 pm  #6


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

paterson1 wrote:

Christmas into the New Year sees marathons of various programs on some cable channels.  Most of these are 24/7 in free preview and running the series in order from show #1.  A few that I have noticed so far.
.
CTV Life- Blue Bloods
CTV Comedy- Big Bang Theory
CTV Drama-Chicago Fire
E!-Friends
CMT-Cheers

Other networks like Showcase and CTV Sci Fi are showing some excellent movies over the holidays.  In addition  free preview on newer networks like BBC First, Magnolia Network, Museum TV, Love Nature, 101 International.

So many channels and no time to watch them!

 

Thanks for this paterson1 📺

Amazon Prime is doing freebie tryouts of their various channels. And Audible usually has a free offer to try them out, they've really bumped up their bonus "included with" content and the Audible special Sydney Crosby rookie feature is terrific and worth a listen...

Some savvy radio host should open up the phone lines and ask people to call in and text them with the shows and movies they're watching and really enjoying, and which ones they tried and found not worth the hype. And a couple of off the beaten path sleeper shows and movies would be fun too.

There's bound to be at least one text from a listener about a show they love that's currently available only on Crave.😉

 

December 28, 2022 6:17 pm  #7


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

paterson1 wrote:

Seems you have changed your tune now.  You referred to Canadian cable channels of getting "on the bandwagon" like series marathons were new here. This is not the case.
 
Marathons have been a staple Christmas-New Years for years and also over long holiday weekends.  I believe Space or CTV Sci-Fi has featured Twilight Zone marathons before. And shows like Leave It To Beaver, Gomer Pyle USMC, MASH, Andy Griffith have already ran various times on CHCH. 

And for you to arrogantly say "once again you have completely misinterpreted what I was saying" is  bogus and a feeble attempt at deflection.  To state that this isn't about comparing TV here vs there is rich.  This is one of your sacred cows that you complain about constantly.  You have said many times how we are penalized because of where we live when a show or channel isn't available here or the rights belong to a different Canadian provider.

The fact that Me TV is running only pilots is interesting and cool, but in reality is a sidebar. It gives you another chance to point out programming you can't get here that you could there.  You do this almost on a daily basis. 

Yes, we've had our go-rounds on this topic forever, but you're just going to have to take my word for it that it wasn't the point of my post. There is no "deflection" going on. It really is as simple as it sounds. When it comes to a New Year's marathon, my choice would be The Twilight Zone, wherever it happens to be showing. This has absolutely nothing to do with U.S. vs. Canadian cable. If CTV SciFi were doing it, that would be great. 

As far as marathons being done in Canada for years, I remember when I had my big C-Band satellite dish, stations down south were already doing this kind of stunting and I recall watching them back then. That was close to 40 years ago, so it's still relatively new to Canadian channels in comparison, many of which did not even exist back then. 

Those C-Band days were great. Probably the most choice for the best price (after scrambling began) ever. Those really were the days to get the best of all worlds - the U.S. (on myriad satellites), Canada (the Anik satellites) and even Mexico (via the Morelos birds.) Not to mention the so-called "wild feeds," where you could see stuff being beamed back to the various networks, often live. Those were some amazing times that will never happen again. But it was great while it lasted!   

My late, lamented C-Band Dish:

 

December 28, 2022 7:26 pm  #8


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

It really was your comment about "some Canadian stations jumping on the bandwagon" when they have already been running various marathons for a long time.  Possibly some may have been programmed even prior to the US. 

Yesterday regarding Howdy Doody's 75th anniversary.  When you mentioned the Canadian CBC version you felt it necessary to editorialize  "when this country finally got television five years later."  Again the comparison of Canada and US which you always do.  Why is this such an issue with you?  

In 1947 Canada was a much smaller and somewhat  poorer country than the US and rebuilding after WW2.  A war that Canada was involved over two years prior to America, and at tremendous cost.  Guess the government may have had more important priorities in 1947 than starting or licensing stations or a TV network?  They made the right choice. TV was likely not the priority in 1947 with most of the public either. 

And we normally are not kicking and screaming into new technology like you try to imply.  It is usually for economic reasons and the difference in the size of the US and Canadian markets.  Economics always rules.  Just like with the demise of the C-Band satellite dishes and free programming. 





 

     Thread Starter
 

December 28, 2022 9:56 pm  #9


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

I have to say I’m a bit miffed that you won’t accept my assurance that there was no knock on Canadian TV meant in my first post. After all, if anyone knows what I was trying to say it was me!
 
But since you seem to want to make this yet another discussion about U.S. vs. Canada in terms of TV and who was ahead of who, here are some facts – not opinions – facts. What they show is that, time after time after time, Canada is always last in adopting some new technology others already have.
 
That may be seen as a good thing by some, but it does appear that we’re always behind our neighbour to the south when it comes to advancements in television technology or broadcasting. Maybe that doesn’t bother you, but I frankly can’t stand having everything new adopted down there, while our government twiddles its thumbs and dithers about when Canadians can get in on the act.
 
Here’s just some of the evidence:
 
TV

The U.S.: began licensing and TV stations began broadcasting in select cities in 1948 - including WBEN Buffalo - although there were experimental stations on the air before then.
 
Canada: We finally got a signal here, but only two of them. Both were the CBC, one in Toronto and the other in Montreal. The year: 1952. It would be a while before others were allowed to follow.
 
Difference: 4 years.
 
UHF Band:
 
The U.S.: Broadcasts began on the UHF band, which left room for more channels, way back in 1952. The fact few sets could get the higher band was one reason why it wasn’t really accepted until the spring of 1964, when all new sets sold in America had to have the UHF band.
 
Canada: We were way behind on this one. The very first UHF station in the country – educational CICA, Channel 19 in Toronto, went on the air in 1970. (It's now TVO.) City TV followed as the first commercial station on the band, way up on Channel 79. That was 1972. By then UHF stations in the States had been on the air for almost two decades.
 
Difference: At least 20 years.
 
 
Colour TV
 
The U.S.: Colour TVs were on sale at enormous prices as soon as 1953. And while most shows weren’t made in colour until the mid-60s, there were shows – including syndicated ones like The Adventures of Superman and the Lone Ranger, along with network programs such as Bonanza – that went all colour before there were even enough sets in use, to prepare for the future. By around 1965, many U.S. shows were being filmed in – as NBC would put it - “living colour.”
 
Canada: I well recall all the listings in TV Guide back then which contained the warning “Canadian stations do not colourcast.” I always wondered why not. The technology was there and so were many of the shows. But it took the CRTC until mid-1966 to grant Canadian stations the right to broadcast in colour and most didn’t go until 1967. Again, why did we need government intervention in this? The marketplace should have been allowed to decide and Canadian viewers were the poorer for these lagging decisions.  
 
Difference: If you count the beginnings of colour TV down south, 13 years.
 
Cable TV Stations:
 
The U.S.: Many American cable-only stations were being pumped onto the satellite and down to subscribers as early as 1979. Ted Turner’s WTBS Atlanta was among the first, but others soon followed and where there were once a few local channels, there were now dozens for subscribers.
 
Canada: Again the CRTC was slow to act. The first licensed cable-only channels were not allowed until 1982. My question, as it often is, is why does the government get to make this decision? In the U.S., if you want to try your luck on a cable station and can get carriage – and don’t go broke in the effort – it’s yours to take that risk. Here, you need permission of the staid folks at the CRTC, who have no real experience in programming anything, let alone a TV network, much less have any idea what the public will like.
 
Difference: Approx. 3 years.
 
HDTV
 
The U.S.:  The U.S. turned off almost all their analog signals and went fully digital in 2009.
 
Canada: The CRTC waited – and waited, and waited – to make the transition until 2011.   
 
Difference: 2 years.
 
So as you can see, we are ALWAYS lagging behind the U.S. in programming traits and technological upgrades. I’m sure it doesn’t bother you but I find it frustrating that Canadians never seem to be in the forefront of these innovations, instead waiting for the States to do something before we finally get our act together. This is the result of too much government interference in the TV business, where some politically appointed czars who’ve never worked a minute in television think they know better and have to be in charge of EVERYTHING.
 
As long as it continues, Canada will always be one step behind everyone else in North America. And I believe that’s totally unnecessary. We have great minds and great innovators in this country. Wouldn’t you like us to lead the way, just once?
 
So if you wonder why I say the Americans always seem to be ahead of us, the facts – and the dates – speak for themselves. We’re not inferior. Just over regulated, which stops progress dead in its tracks. I can only wonder what Canada could do if the powers-that-be would just get out of our way for once. 

 

December 28, 2022 10:48 pm  #10


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

The Twilight Zone Marathon runs again this year on SYFY. Dec 31 at 5AM until Jan 3 at 3:30AM. It is available on ustvgo.tv. Some of the channels work without a NORD VPN. I don't know if SYFY is one of them.

 

December 29, 2022 1:19 am  #11


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Well first off, I am sorry you had to waste so much of your time and effort with a rather pointless response. You are not being honest with your assertion that it is I who is making this about the US and Canadian systems and who was first etc.

What I am doing is questioning and correcting your misleading information. You are the one that is constantly whining about how our broadcast system is not the same as the US and how you can't watch this streamer or that show etc. Like I said, you do this almost daily, and of course drag in your dislike for regulations and CRTC.  See your comments above.

 I also never said I didn't accept your assurance that this particular comment you made wasn't a knock against domestic TV. So no need to be miffed.  What I was referring to (for the third time) was your comment about some Canadian channels jumping on the "marathon bandwagon" which is incorrect.

My assertion about why licensing TV was four years after the US was sound.  TV wasn't as much a priority here in 1948.

Canada was broke, rebuilding and retooling after six years of war.  Moving back to a peace time economy was the priority.  It wasn't long before the economy was booming and domestic TV was introduced.  Not a difficult thing to comprehend.  Experimental TV in Canada began in 1932 in Montreal but was abandoned prior to WW2. 

Interesting you brought up cable.  We had cable many years before the US.  I was so disappointed the first time I went to the US in 1974 and all of the hotels and motels on our trip could only receive 3 or 4 channels, all off air and no cable available.

Even in a small town like Fergus in 1968 we had a much better variety of TV  to choose from with 12 channels, all clear signals, no interference, with better colour than a home antenna.  I know you were referring to cable only channels which is something different. But in terms of cable we were many years ahead.

You mention about the two year difference in the analogue conversion and HD signals with the US going mostly digital in 2009. However City tv in Toronto began some broadcasting in HD in 2003 and CBLT in 2005.  

And since you chose to compare US and Canadian services with your list, why does the US still have hundreds of AM radio stations that sign off every day at sunset?  I thought sunrise to sunset radio finished about 60 years ago. 

 

     Thread Starter
 

December 29, 2022 11:52 am  #12


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Indeed cable tv has been around much longer in Canada than in the U.S. Why? In the case of the GTA, to get better reception of the U.S. networks. In other areas of the province not near the U.S. border, to get reception of the U.S. networks. As for Canada having more important priorties than television in the late 1940's, there is probably some truth to that. However, those that could afford a set back then [Jan 1949 $719 + $100-$150 for the antenna] had four years to get hooked on WBEN ch 4 programming. What the CBC offered in 1952, other than NHL Hockey, seemed inferior by comparison. Perhaps if CBC TV had been around in 1948, viewers would have been more receptive to their shows. 

 

December 29, 2022 3:47 pm  #13


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Good points mace.  The ability to bring in US channels was absolutely a big factor for cable's early rise in Canada.  Not the only reason however.  I remember when we bought cable many things were stressed.  

No need for the rusty, cumbersome and dangerous antenna on of the roof. Never having to climb up again to straighten the unit after a storm, or replace with a new one.  Doubling or tripling the number of channels received, all clear signals with no interference between channels.  If you had a colour set, the improved signals made for much better colour with no fading or ghosting.

Our cable company also had a community station that carried local hockey, lacrosse, news, council meetings, parades, church services, music shows, high school programming and even a couple of phone in programs.  Believe it or not these amateur/volunteer shows became very popular.  And the only way you would see them was with cable. 
 
Even though there was some duplication with prime time programming, local stations also carried a lot more of their own syndicated shows.  I remember CKVR, CFPL and CKOC in Kitchener had a mix of US syndicated series programming and locally produced shows in addition to the network.

Especially with CBC, CKVR and CFPL were private stations.  Private affiliates had to carry CBC news, current affairs and sports programming, but were given some flexibility with everything else.  CBC actually did have some very high rated domestic shows back when cable came onto the scene but some was at the discretion of the private affiliates. Even CBC's US imports did not always run at the same time as the network.  

     Thread Starter
 

December 29, 2022 4:25 pm  #14


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

paterson1 wrote:

Well first off, I am sorry you had to waste so much of your time and effort with a rather pointless response. You are not being honest with your assertion that it is I who is making this about the US and Canadian systems and who was first etc.

What I am doing is questioning and correcting your misleading information. You are the one that is constantly whining about how our broadcast system is not the same as the US and how you can't watch this streamer or that show etc. Like I said, you do this almost daily, and of course drag in your dislike for regulations and CRTC.  See your comments above. 

I didn't find it pointless at all. And yes, I don't hide my contempt for those fatuous know-nothings at the CRTC. The figures provided clearly prove that Canada always seems to be behind when it comes to the "next thing" in broadcasting. And the only reason for it appears to be a) we are a smaller country so it often costs more to acquire new technology and b) the government stands in the way of everything, whether it be colour TV or HD conversion or cable-only stations. They simply cannot stand to let broadcasters do what they know how to do without sticking their bony fingers into everything so they can impose some kind of "control" on it. Again, they're not TV people for the most part. They're bureaucrats. Is that really who you want telling you how to run your business?

I never appeared in front of the Commission, but I know plenty who have and they all say the experience was horrendous. They were trying to explain the facts to a group of people who didn't know what they were talking about - but who held their futures in their hands. That's never a comfortable feeling or a good thing. 

paterson1 wrote:

I also never said I didn't accept your assurance that this particular comment you made wasn't a knock against domestic TV. So no need to be miffed.  What I was referring to (for the third time) was your comment about some Canadian channels jumping on the "marathon bandwagon" which is incorrect.

Not when you consider it's been going on in the U.S., as noted, for at least 40 years. In comparison, it's relatively new to Canada and where do you think the stations here got the idea? As Fred Allen once noted, "Imitation is the sincerest form of television."

paterson1 wrote:

My assertion about why licensing TV was four years after the US was sound.  TV wasn't as much a priority here in 1948.

Canada was broke, rebuilding and retooling after six years of war.  Moving back to a peace time economy was the priority.  It wasn't long before the economy was booming and domestic TV was introduced.  Not a difficult thing to comprehend.  Experimental TV in Canada began in 1932 in Montreal but was abandoned prior to WW2.

Well, I guess we'll never know for sure because the powers-that-be never gave us the option to choose. You know, the public. The people who should be able to determine how to spend their income (after taxes.)

Besides, there were more TVs here before 1952 than you're admitting. People who could afford them bought them to watch Channel 4 out of Buffalo and I suspect the BBG, the precursor to the CRTC, didn't much like the idea even then that Canadians would prefer U.S. output. Not much has changed to this day, or the CTV, Global and City TV skeds wouldn't predominantly be filled with American shows.  

paterson1 wrote:

Interesting you brought up cable.  We had cable many years before the US.  I was so disappointed the first time I went to the US in 1974 and all of the hotels and motels on our trip could only receive 3 or 4 channels, all off air and no cable available.

Even in a small town like Fergus in 1968 we had a much better variety of TV  to choose from with 12 channels, all clear signals, no interference, with better colour than a home antenna.  I know you were referring to cable only channels which is something different. But in terms of cable we were many years ahead.

I was going to bring up the point mace did, but he stated it well. The main reason for Canadians to shell out for cable was because they wanted either access to U.S. stations they couldn't get or to be able to receive them better. I feel safe in saying that almost no one got cable just to watch the CBC. 

paterson1 wrote:

You mention about the two year difference in the analogue conversion and HD signals with the US going mostly digital in 2009. However City tv in Toronto began some broadcasting in HD in 2003 and CBLT in 2005.

 
Wow, two whole stations in a country of 38 million. Yep, that sure proves your point. It was the entire U.S. that went first by several years. Why didn't we? Again, expense on one hand and government dithering on the other. They were first. Rather than denigrating Canadian TV, I'm asking why can't we ever be the innovators just once? 
 

paterson1 wrote:

And since you chose to compare US and Canadian services with your list, why does the US still have hundreds of AM radio stations that sign off every day at sunset?  I thought sunrise to sunset radio finished about 60 years ago. 

I'm not entirely sure how this fits in the argument but OK. There are more stations in the U.S. than here, licensed when AM was king. They had to make sure that small towns were served while also ensuring that they minimized interference. That meant either a power or pattern reduction or a sign-off. I don't believe the FCC is licensing daytimers any more. In fact, WTOR in Youngstown, N.Y. at 770 on the dial may be one of the last of them. (Ironically, its target audience is the ethnic communities in Toronto.)

On that subject, perhaps the strangest daytimer ever was right here in Ontario. CHYR Leamington was on 710 AM during the daylight hours, but instead of signing off, they switched frequencies to 730, to protect WOR in New York, another station, CKVM in Quebec and to keep from being interfered with by a high powered outlet in Cuba.

That is the only case I've ever heard of where this occurred in either country, although I suppose it could have happened elsewhere. I only heard it a few times, but I remember they had an announcement just before sign-off, telling listeners to tune their dial two places to keep listening, then playing a sound effect, which would fade out with the signal on 710 - and keep playing with a fade-in on 730. A very strange necessity and it eventually stopped for good after CHYR switched to FM in 1993. 

 

December 29, 2022 4:32 pm  #15


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

 

December 30, 2022 12:57 am  #16


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Well this is funny RA.  Your latest response is dripping with sarcasm and anger.  Even when I point out something that we were ahead of our friends in the US and did better, you get your back up. By the way I never said that CBC was a draw for people buying cable, and the two examples of early digital TV I was trying to keep it local.  CBC also had digital signals in 2005 in other large markets.

Claiming things like the only reason cable was more advanced in Canada was because everyone wanted US programming with a better signal is mostly true but not exclusive by any means. As usual you give Canada no credit. Even when we were the innovators on something major as cable with extensive service across the country, many years ahead of the US doesn't seem to count with you.  Somehow you always manage to intertwine debates with your personal prejudices and hate of the CRTC.  This is where your arguments always fall apart.

By the way, allowing distant US signals in remote areas far beyond their service areas was thanks to the CRTC.  They approved cable companies to carry stations from Buffalo, Detroit, Seattle, Boston, Cleveland to more remote distant cities and towns across the country.
 
This was to provide a similar quality of service to areas further from the border and unable to pick up US signals, and channels from larger Canadian markets.  These areas had either not received US channels or the signals were unwatchable prior to cable.  Allowing cable to provide American local television across the country put these stations on equal footing with their Canadian counterparts.   So much for the CRTC being anti-US and also very democratic.

In the 1960's where I lived we already received Buffalo TV.  So the American signals for our family was not as much a selling point.  The clearer signals for all channels was the point, the end of ghosting, atmospheric and channel interference was a big factor, and  getting rid of an ugly, big and old antenna was also a big plus. No more dangerous trips up to the roof.
 
But best of all overnight we doubled the number of channels we would receive and all with clear signals, and more variety of shows to watch. This is why I said it was disappointing going to the US in the 70's even early 80's because of the very limited choice of TV channels in most communities, usually only 3 or 4 and not always the best signal.
 
Imagine, Timmins or Collingwood had at least triple the choice and variety of channels than a much larger city like Nashville had in the 70's.  But of course you never bring up or acknowledge things like this. Even today our system of cable for local television is superior and makes more sense than the US style. 

You also have proven once again you know nothing about economics.  Trying to blame everything on government dithering and the CRTC and basically ignoring the size and population of the two markets is a huge gap in your thesis.   It's the economy stupid...get with the program and stop ignoring facts.

Oh, by the way we did innovate many times.  A place where you worked CITY-TV was the first of it's kind in it's programming, style and the way the building was wired so any part of the facility on any floor could be a studio.

 CITY was copied all over the world because it it's unique presentation, attitude, style and programming.  A US friend of mine who lived in Canada for a few years always remarked what a unique channel CITY was.  He had lived in various American cities and in Europe and claimed he had never seen a channel like CITY.  He loved the live downtown street aspect to the news, Electric Circus and Speaker's Corner.

In addition let's also remember another Toronto innovation to broadcasting with the Roger's radio that for the first time didn't need batteries or an aerial. These made in Toronto radios only needed to be plugged in to the electrical current.  The concept is still in use today. 

     Thread Starter
 

December 30, 2022 10:40 am  #17


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

paterson1 wrote:

Well this is funny RA.  Your latest response is dripping with sarcasm and anger.  Even when I point out something that we were ahead of our friends in the US and did better, you get your back up. By the way I never said that CBC was a draw for people buying cable, and the two examples of early digital TV I was trying to keep it local.  CBC also had digital signals in 2005 in other large markets.

Claiming things like the only reason cable was more advanced in Canada was because everyone wanted US programming with a better signal is mostly true but not exclusive by any means. As usual you give Canada no credit. Even when we were the innovators on something major as cable with extensive service across the country, many years ahead of the US doesn't seem to count with you.  Somehow you always manage to intertwine debates with your personal prejudices and hate of the CRTC.  This is where your arguments always fall apart.

By the way, allowing distant US signals in remote areas far beyond their service areas was thanks to the CRTC.  They approved cable companies to carry stations from Buffalo, Detroit, Seattle, Boston, Cleveland to more remote distant cities and towns across the country.
 
This was to provide a similar quality of service to areas further from the border and unable to pick up US signals, and channels from larger Canadian markets.  These areas had either not received US channels or the signals were unwatchable prior to cable.  Allowing cable to provide American local television across the country put these stations on equal footing with their Canadian counterparts.   So much for the CRTC being anti-US and also very democratic.

In the 1960's where I lived we already received Buffalo TV.  So the American signals for our family was not as much a selling point.  The clearer signals for all channels was the point, the end of ghosting, atmospheric and channel interference was a big factor, and  getting rid of an ugly, big and old antenna was also a big plus. No more dangerous trips up to the roof.

Yes, Canada was ahead on cable. (While you conveniently ignore the four other significant examples I gave where we clearly weren't.) And like it or not, the main reason was getting U.S. signals. I think even the most staunch Canadian supporter would have to agree that in those early days, that was the main reason anyone paid for what was otherwise free signals. (I'm not sure what kind of antenna you had - in the neighbourhood we lived in, you put it up once and left it there. It did not require constant maintenance and in fact, my tower hasn't needed any kind of fix since it was installed more than 40 years ago. End of danger.)

And of course the CRTC allowed the U.S. channels in. This wasn't "progressive" or "democratic." The cable companies told them in no uncertain terms their businesses would fail if the U.S. stations were somehow excluded. Even the CRTC could see that. Not sure why you can't. It doesn't prove the Commission's "foresight." They knew the industry would die in those early days without the main draw for people to put up the money for something they could get for nothing.

paterson1 wrote:

Even today our system of cable for local television is superior and makes more sense than the US style.

 
Superior in what way? Paying triple the price for far fewer channels, and having to put up with simsub and all sorts of other regulations? If this is your definition of superior I'm not sure which dictionary you're using. Are our cell phone services also superior in some way, since they're all controlled by the same three companies and regulated by the same CRTC? I'm betting you'd be alone in that assessment.

paterson1 wrote:

You also have proven once again you know nothing about economics.  Trying to blame everything on government dithering and the CRTC and basically ignoring the size and population of the two markets is a huge gap in your thesis.   It's the economy stupid...get with the program and stop ignoring facts.

Yes, it IS the economy. That's why broadcasters should be allowed to fly or crash of their own volition. No one needs big brother government breathing down their necks telling them how they have to run their business and what they need to show on their channels. That's the free market economy. If they fail, they took the risk. But if they succeed, the rewards can be beyond their expectations. Let them try, without governments telling them what to do. 

There is a role for the CRTC and the government. You need a body that can prevent stations from interfering and overlapping, as happened too frequently in the early days of broadcasting. And they can decide who gets a licence with public airspace so precious. (Not the case for the Internet, but enough about Bill C-11.)  But for the love of God, stay out of programming! Why is that such a hard concept for you to grasp? Your vaunted "economy" will decide who wins and who loses. Not a bunch of faceless ignorant bureaucrats in Hull.

paterson1 wrote:

 Oh, by the way we did innovate many times.  A place where you worked CITY-TV was the first of it's kind in it's programming, style and the way the building was wired so any part of the facility on any floor could be a studio.

 CITY was copied all over the world because it it's unique presentation, attitude, style and programming.  A US friend of mine who lived in Canada for a few years always remarked what a unique channel CITY was.  He had lived in various American cities and in Europe and claimed he had never seen a channel like CITY.  He loved the live downtown street aspect to the news, Electric Circus and Speaker's Corner.

I never said I worked for City TV, just that I knew a lot of people who did. As far as I know, I've never said online exactly which stations I worked out, outside of CFTR. That said, I was never a big fan of Moses Znaimer, who has an ego the size of Pittsburgh. But I will give him credit for this - he was able to persevere IN SPITE of the CRTC, not because of it. It's a perfect example of how Canadians can create something original if regulators stop putting endless and needless obstacles in their way.  

As noted in a previous post, I know a ton of broadcasters who have gone before the CRTC and have come away absolutely gobsmacked by how little the Commision folk seem to know about the business and how their mandates almost always work against innovation or new ideas. Ask anyone who's done it and you'll get an earful.  

paterson1 wrote:

In addition let's also remember another Toronto innovation to broadcasting with the Roger's radio that for the first time didn't need batteries or an aerial. These made in Toronto radios only needed to be plugged in to the electrical current.  The concept is still in use today. 

I will make this my last statement on this (how did a thread on New Year marathons turn into this?) and let you have the last word if you want, before this gets too tedious. ("Too late!" I can hear most people say.)

I find it kind of ironic that you need to point out the times when Canadians were able to innovate. (And by the way, creating a radio is not quite the same thing as providing programming for it.) And while I know you think I hate everything Canadian, I can assure you that's not true. In fact, if you re-read my original post that followed your first take, you'll see I'm acknowledging that Canada has the talent to lead and innovate and there are a lot of smart people who could make things even better - if they were allowed to. 

We just need to get the bumbling bureaucrats who always think they know better out of the way and let those folks soar. Who knows what heights they could really reach then? 

 

December 30, 2022 1:19 pm  #18


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Yes my apology to all of the members of SOWNY for this long self indulgent post from myself and RA.  Anyone who is still reading this rambling repetitive and in my case hard to follow spiel deserves recognition.

First off, I didn't ignore the four examples you gave of innovation because I didn't disagree.  I don't understand why you think that we need to be the same in everything as the US, and why if we are a few later is such a big deal.  My point always has been because it is likely because of our much smaller population and market. It is harder to make a buck here. You usually only focused on government regulation and CRTC interference, which is secondary in my opinion.  Economics will always rule.

It is not up to the CRTC to make interesting and innovative programming.  It is up to the people who hold the broadcast license.  Blaming regulation, cancon, and the CRTC is just an excuse to do nothing.  It was this way in 1970 and still is today.  A few like CITY in the past rose to the occasion, many others were simply lazy and didn't try very hard, or had unrealistic expectations.

Despite all of this intervention from no mind bureaucrats "telling broadcasters what to program" as you like to think, some innovation and worthwhile domestic programming has managed to penetrate here and is enjoyed outside of Canada.

So in fact it can be done, and is being done.  Having a hit show is very hard and requires dedication and time. I won't list the popular Canadian shows that have many fans outside of the country because it would be an embarrassment for you.  And almost all of these shows are set in Canada.

So your assertion that we are "never innovative" is wrong and wrapped up with your odd reasoning that only you seem to understand.

Oh, by the way, wasn't CKVR TV the first to go all night in North America?  I believe it was in 1958 when Barrie's channel 3 started experimenting with an all night show.  I may be wrong, but I seem to remember them also having the odd all night marathon of some shows like The Three Stooges, Munsters and Beverly Hillbillies in their classic TV era.  This would have been in the 1980's I believe.  

So much for bandwagons...      

     Thread Starter
 

December 30, 2022 1:34 pm  #19


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

paterson1 wrote:

   my apology to all of the members of SOWNY for this long self indulgent post 

Cash is monitoring Christmas tunes on CHFI and just about everyone else is enjoying the CHEERS marathon at channel 575 so no apology is necessary. 
 

 

December 30, 2022 1:46 pm  #20


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Actually, CKVR goes back a lot farther than that as an original "all night" station, although it had nothing to do with marathons. This is from March 1958, a story written for the Toronto Star by none other than Gordon Sinclair.



They also got into the act a second time, in 1969.

 

December 30, 2022 2:03 pm  #21


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

Ms. C. wrote:

paterson1 wrote:

   my apology to all of the members of SOWNY for this long self indulgent post 

Cash is monitoring Christmas tunes on CHFI and just about everyone else is enjoying the CHEERS marathon at channel 575 so no apology is necessary. 
 

Well thank you Ms. C. and thank you RA.....now back to our regularly scheduled programming...

     Thread Starter
 

January 1, 2023 10:33 am  #22


Re: Series Marathons Into The New Year

No apologies necessary RA and P1. I have always enjoyed your sometimes long winded discussions. It is not always possible to explain your point of view in several sentences. I think it be a blast to watch some of your encounters on TVO's The Agenda. That would be appointment viewing for me.