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January 9, 2020 12:46 pm  #1


New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

The CRTC – finally back to work after being off since Dec. 23rd – has announced its first order of business for 2020 is determining whether the GTHA has room for yet another radio station – on the FM dial, no less. This time, it’s an application for an ethnic station on 91.7 to operate at 800 watts from Ajax/Pickering.
 
If the Commission determines there's room in that market, then others will be invited to apply.
 
I’m personally unsure about this. For one thing, the FM dial is already so crowded that stations interfere with each other in spots or can’t even be heard in places in Toronto. And for another, how many ethnic formats do we need?
 
I get that Toronto and environs is one of the most diverse cities in the world, but we already have (on AM) CHIN, CHLO (aka AM530), the new Brampton-based CIRF at 1350, CHKT, CJMR and several stations on the so-called X band (1610-1710) that almost no one even knows about.
 
On FM, there are two CHINs (which I still think isn’t right – their 91.9 was supposed to be a rebroadcaster of their “weak” AM signal but is now a de facto new station), the CMR outlet at 101.3, a Greek station, one that caters to the Tamil community and several others I’m sure I forgot.
 
Isn’t that enough? Anyway, if you’re interested in submitting an intervention or have an interest in applying for your own station, the deadline for submissions is Feb. 24th.
 
CRTC Seeks Comments On Ajax/Pickering Market

 

January 9, 2020 12:58 pm  #2


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

I'd like see Durham region get a news-talk station. There are many local issues here that don't get reported or discussed anywhere on the air.


"Life without echo is really no life at all." - Dan Ingram
 

January 9, 2020 1:33 pm  #3


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

Dale Patterson wrote:

I'd like see Durham region get a news-talk station. There are many local issues here that don't get reported or discussed anywhere on the air.

A great suggestion!
 

 

January 9, 2020 1:39 pm  #4


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

Best way for that to happen would be for CKDO to launch more of that type of content. That would be great for the area.

A stand-alone startup would probably never get out of the red.

 

January 9, 2020 1:41 pm  #5


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

RadioActive wrote:

On FM, there are two CHINs (which I still think isn’t right – their 91.9 was supposed to be a rebroadcaster of their “weak” AM signal but is now a de facto new station), the CMR outlet at 101.3, a Greek station, one that caters to the Tamil community and several others I’m sure I forgot.
 
Isn’t that enough?

Worth mentioning too that 88.9 and 101.3 both make full use of HD, with each station effectively being 4.

As for if that's enough....I have no idea. The business model for these stations is a bit different, and if someone thinks there's still money to be made, I say let 'em go for it.

 

January 9, 2020 1:47 pm  #6


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

Theres no way 91.7 would work really well with GIANT FM across the lake would blow it out of the water 

 

January 9, 2020 1:53 pm  #7


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

And don't forget CHIN-2 is right next door at 91.9 with a half decent signal in parts of the GTA. There simply isn't room for another newcomer at that space on the dial, although I suppose if it's a very limited range, I'm sure somehow they could make it work. Whether enough people would be able to hear it is another story entirely.  

     Thread Starter
 

January 9, 2020 1:57 pm  #8


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

Dale Patterson wrote:

I'd like see Durham region get a news-talk station. There are many local issues here that don't get reported or discussed anywhere on the air.

That would be great but it will never happen. Do you really want another CKNT, which I will always believe was applied for by the owner strictly as a place to broadcast his Steelheads hockey games. 

Also, I firmly believe the CRTC has a strong disposition for ethnic formats, so if you were to suggest say, an oldies, Top 40 or yes, talk - FM outlet in this area, you likely wouldn't get very far. 

     Thread Starter
 

January 9, 2020 2:41 pm  #9


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

RadioActive wrote:

Dale Patterson wrote:

I'd like see Durham region get a news-talk station. There are many local issues here that don't get reported or discussed anywhere on the air.

That would be great but it will never happen. Do you really want another CKNT, which I will always believe was applied for by the owner strictly as a place to broadcast his Steelheads hockey games. 

Also, I firmly believe the CRTC has a strong disposition for ethnic formats, so if you were to suggest say, an oldies, Top 40 or yes, talk - FM outlet in this area, you likely wouldn't get very far. 

When Power broadcasting bought CKDO from Grant Broadcasting I'm sure they considered the idea, but music stayed. Then later, Corus must have also thought that one through-especially since they could have easily tossed on AM 640 content-Several American Doctor talk shows-to name some, while adding in some local talk content.
Whatever thinking Corus maintained, music still remained on CKDO. 

Today, with CKDO in the hands of Durham Radio inc, who knows what their plans are, but it seems music is still the plan. I hope so because I like the classic hits on that station. 


RadioWiz & RadioQuiz are NOT the same person. 
RadioWiz & THE Wiz are NOT the same person.

 
 

January 9, 2020 3:58 pm  #10


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

In an ideal world 107.7 would carry oldies and 1580 would go talk. As for 91.7, I think it would be fine signal-wise if it stuck to covering Ajax-Pickering. Once the owners decide to push advertising or coverage demands into Scarborough, that would spell trouble.

 

January 9, 2020 4:03 pm  #11


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

And don't think that it wasn't they're contemplating in the back of their minds, as we've seen endlessly with the Evanov example. 

The Ajax market hasn't been the same since CHOO left 1390!

     Thread Starter
 

January 9, 2020 6:01 pm  #12


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

RadioActive wrote:

And don't think that it wasn't they're contemplating in the back of their minds, as we've seen endlessly with the Evanov example. The Ajax market hasn't been the same since CHOO left 1390!

Which do you mean ... new station pushing its weight into Scarberia or a 1580-107.7 split? The former I would not want to see, and wouldn't work with 91.9 (in fact engineering will have to be tight as it is). The latter I could care less if it doesn't break any rules (I haven't looked at ownership etc). If it does break rules, try to sell it, or if it requires an opening for other potential competing applicants so be it). I do think the market could handle a format split. CHOO is now CJKX 95.9 if I'm correct, or ...?
 

 

January 9, 2020 6:17 pm  #13


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

What I meant was that there are a number of owners who seem to take on peripheral signals with dicey futures with the goal of weaseling their way into the more lucrative Toronto market. Z103.5, the Evanovs' station in Orangeville was repeatedly slapped down by the CRTC when it tried to encroach on the T.O.market, by essentially ignoring the city of licence. 

They were ordered to pay more attention to Orangeville and less to downtown Toronto, amid a host of excuses by the owners as to why it was a necessity if they were to survive and stay on the air. Last I looked, they're still there and there's no bankruptcy sign on the door, so I assume they're managing somehow. 

     Thread Starter
 

January 9, 2020 6:52 pm  #14


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

91.7 probably wouldn’t work for a new station anywhere in the GTA. As for a CKDO split, I don’t mind the idea of a talk station on A.m., makes sense actually. speaking of Evanoff radio, anyone got any updates on 93 nine moving from a religious format to something more main stream? They proposed a little while ago, we’re shut down by the CRTC, and I think may have proposed it again.

 

January 9, 2020 8:41 pm  #15


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

Splitting the CKDO signals is a really interesting proposition, but it has two issues:
1) They'd be over the ownership limit. They're already in a grey area with calling 107.7 a "booster"
2) A new full-time AM News/Talk operation would lose a lot of money.

 

January 9, 2020 10:42 pm  #16


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

I did a talk show on CKDO, they don't want talk, it costs too much to make happen...they have a limited number of announcers that have been there for years...it works, the business model works and the king pin at Durham Radio is KX96, that is the straw that stirs the drink...

I am with you, I think the market is saturated...plus don't forget the Torres brothers have an Uxbridge station, so that market is pretty well covered...

 


The world would be so good if it weren't for some people...
 

January 9, 2020 10:48 pm  #17


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

RadioAaron wrote:

Best way for that to happen would be for CKDO to launch more of that type of content. That would be great for the area.

A stand-alone startup would probably never get out of the red.

When Corus owned it, CKDO did try a talk format for a while but if memory serves it was never given the right resources to succeed.
 

 

January 9, 2020 11:14 pm  #18


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

RadioActive wrote:

What I meant was that there are a number of owners who seem to take on peripheral signals with dicey futures with the goal of weaseling their way into the more lucrative Toronto market. Z103.5, the Evanovs' station in Orangeville was repeatedly slapped down by the CRTC when it tried to encroach on the T.O.market, by essentially ignoring the city of licence. 

They were ordered to pay more attention to Orangeville and less to downtown Toronto, amid a host of excuses by the owners as to why it was a necessity if they were to survive and stay on the air. Last I looked, they're still there and there's no bankruptcy sign on the door, so I assume they're managing somehow. 

 
And the Z103.5/ Proud FM (103.9 to 103.7) transmitter swap still don’t appear to have any update soon...

In accordance with the topic, Giant FM 91.7 from Niagara is still very clear in the Durham Region, as the region is directly opposite to the Niagara Region (on the USA side). Just wonder how the proposed station on 91.7MHz can overcome signal interference from the 50kW blowtorch...

Furthermore GTA already has plenty of radio stations targeting minorities, such as South Asian, Chinese and more. Pickering and Ajax are extremely diversified cities, and they manage to receive vast amount of minority radio stations in the metropolitan. Therefore the ratings may be dismal for the new station.

 

January 10, 2020 10:58 am  #19


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

Interesting comments...800 watts on 91.7 would probably hold against Welland 91.7 and various adjacents etc in a core radius around the transmitter. Ajax-Pickering - if they truly want to stick to that - isn't a huge footprint. Signal would begin to get hammered beyond that, and no real harm would likely occur to Welland market. Caveat: I'm not an engineer, I'm a DXer, so all IMO. Any engineers on this board?
 

 

January 12, 2020 5:35 pm  #20


Re: New FM Station Sought For Pickering/Ajax - If There's Market Room

Muffaraw Joe wrote:

I did a talk show on CKDO, they don't want talk, it costs too much to make happen...they have a limited number of announcers that have been there for years...it works, the business model works and the king pin at Durham Radio is KX96, that is the straw that stirs the drink...
 

And that's just it...I'm not suggesting they will do it; I'm just saying they're the only ones who possibly could. If it doesn't work for them, definitely won't work for anyone else.