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July 16, 2023 10:01 am  #1


Would A 500,000 AM Watt Signal From Ohio Come In Here During The Day?

I've always been curious about this, but I wasn't alive at the time to ever test it myself. Maybe someone here knows. 

In January 1934, WLW-AM in Cincinatti became the first (and eventually the only) station in North America allowed to broadcast at an incredible 500,000 watts. It was such a powerful signal that the Crosley-owned radio outlet was actually able to charge advertisers national rates for their programs.

You can guess what happened next - stations across the country started bombarding the FCC with requests to do the same. Eventually, in 1939, the Commission decided to restrict radio stations in the U.S. to a maximum power of just 50K - still pretty good, but not even in the same league as half a million watts. 

My question is this - while obviously this would have boomed into Toronto at night, would listeners here have been able to hear WLW during the daytime? How well would it have come in? Was it like a local or maybe something from out of town, like Buffalo? 

I can guess the signal did make it here - CFRB, which at the time was on neighbouring 690 AM - complained constantly about the Cincinatti giant's interference with its signal and WLW engineers had to reconfigure its pattern to try to fix the problem.

From an old but interesting Radio World article on the issue:

"The existence of such a powerful signal on the radio airwaves was certain to create interference. And sure enough, in the summer of 1934, the FCC began receiving complaints from the Canadian government about interference to CFRB, which operated with 10 kW on 690 kHz in Toronto, 400 miles Northeast of Cincinnati. “With station WLW operating with 500 kilowatts,” read the official complaint, “the service area of the Toronto station was reduced to little more than the city of Toronto itself, and 50 miles out the signals from Toronto were completely obliterated.”

The article goes on to explain how they fixed the problem but kept the power.

When the Ohio station eventually went back to 50,000 watts, the problems went away for good and CFRB relocated to its next frequency - 860 - in 1941. (When the CBC demanded use of that frequency, 'RB moved one last time to its current home at 1010.)

So for those who are more technically inclined than me (which is most of you!) would this 500K giant have come in here during the day? I wonder what the AM DX was like back then, with so many fewer stations and so much less electrical noise on the dial.

Image courtesy Wikipedia


 

July 16, 2023 5:25 pm  #2


Re: Would A 500,000 AM Watt Signal From Ohio Come In Here During The Day?

Yes a 500KW WLW would be receivable in GTA during the daytime with an omni pattern.Current Toronto AMs reach 280 miles 400km to north in the daytime.

 

July 16, 2023 5:37 pm  #3


Re: Would A 500,000 AM Watt Signal From Ohio Come In Here During The Day?

No wonder Rogers, then the owners of CFRB, complained so bitterly about the interference. 

     Thread Starter
 

July 16, 2023 9:08 pm  #4


Re: Would A 500,000 AM Watt Signal From Ohio Come In Here During The Day?

I am located near Grand Bend Ontario. Using my Panasonic RF-2200 in a noise free environment I can receive WLW's 50KW daytime signal. It is weak and not particularly pleasant to listen to given the noise floor, but it is solid. At 500KW it would have less noise but still be quite weak. 

A few years ago I drove by the impressive transmitter site. That diamond shaped antenna is very distinct and there is a house adjacent to the transmitter building. At one time the engineer lived there, perhaps they still do. A subdivision has grown around the area.

Last edited by darcyh (July 16, 2023 9:11 pm)

 

July 16, 2023 9:11 pm  #5


Re: Would A 500,000 AM Watt Signal From Ohio Come In Here During The Day?

The inverse-square law still kicks in here. Increasing the power 10x doesn't increase the reach of the signal 10x. It increases the reach of the signal by the square root of 10, so about 3.3x. The ground conductivity across Ohio is mediocre, and the fresh water of Lake Erie isn't a great conductor either. 

So, no, a 500 kW WLW wouldn't have put a very usable daytime signal into Toronto. It would have been somewhat usable in Cleveland on radios of the era. 

The issue Rogers had with CFRB on 690 was during critical hours (just after sunrise/before sunset) and at at night, when skywave picked up that big WLW signal and slammed it into Toronto. That's why WLW had to install a parasitic antenna element north of the WLW site in Mason, Ohio to reduce the signal level along the axis toward Toronto. 

Now - 500kW at the bottom of the dial on the huge conductivity of the prairies? If CBK on 540 had existed and had been able to go to that power level, it would have covered many hundreds of miles by day, even more than its already substantial 50 kW signal covers now. 

 

July 16, 2023 9:51 pm  #6


Re: Would A 500,000 AM Watt Signal From Ohio Come In Here During The Day?

Thanks for all the answers. I've long wondered about this and it appears the answer is "no." But what a signal!

     Thread Starter
 

July 17, 2023 8:44 am  #7


Re: Would A 500,000 AM Watt Signal From Ohio Come In Here During The Day?

I recall in the 90's, once I got out of the GTA, I listened to Phil Hendrie on either 640 or 680 after dark in a truck , can't remember which, I believe it was out of Atlanta ? Ironically, there are AM  stations at both frequency's based in Atlanta. https://radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/locate?select=city&city=Atlanta&state=GA

Last edited by mic'em (July 17, 2023 8:45 am)