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One of my closest friends called me tonight, laughing that he’d just got a call from Numeris, (the former BBM) who told him they were ‘interested in what the people of Thornhill were listening to on their radios’ and wanted him to take part in their upcoming ratings survey.
This guy worked for almost 40 years in Toronto radio and TV, and stopped the woman on the phone as she tried to explain that Numeris wasn’t selling anything, we’re legitimate, we’re not solicitors, etc. etc.
The fact that he’s retired now means he’s eligible to take part and he gleefully agreed to do just that. What surprised him – and I confess, me – is that they’re sending two weeks worth of paper diaries, so he can fill out his listening choices whether he’s at home, in the car or at his mother’s cousin’s ex-wife’s house. Or, in his case, walking the dog. Frankly, I’m surprised ex-broadcasters are allowed in, since they may have strong ties to former places of employment that could potentially skew – or if they left on bad terms – screw the results for various stations.
But Numeris lady promised the thing would be in the mail in the next few days, although I don’t know if the old two dollar “payment” will also be included. He told me it was a weird conversation, because he knew far more about what the spokeswoman was talking about than she did,
When he asked why they were still using diaries and not PPM’s, she had no idea what PPM’s were. He explained it to her and she sounded horribly confused and said she'd only been there a month. But she continued with her spiel anyway. My friend says he’s excited to be filling one of these things out, after having so much of his past being decided by items just like this. And he jokingly (I think) said he’d be calling CFRB tomorrow to ask what they would do for him if he were to give them prominent placement in his book.
That’s the first time I’ve ever actually known someone who got one of these things. Besides myself, that is.
A long, long time ago, when I was, as they say, “between assignments” in radio, what was then BBM called to say they wanted my opinion on what TV shows I watched. Those were definitely diary only days and I jumped at the chance to fill one out.
It just so happened that at the time I lived in an exceptional reception area and when the diary arrived, it was one of those DXers dream weeks. Everything was coming in from everywhere and with a rotating antenna you could pull in amazing out of town stations.
I remember wondering what they would think as a viewer in Toronto wrote down such unusual locales as Cleveland, Erie, Florida, Regina and in one memorable case, even Denver, all interrupting Buffalo and Barrie signals on the prime analog stations for catching these finds, channels 2, 3 & 4.
Being the obsessive compulsive TV nut that I was (and still am) I kept copious notes, even listing when I watched something off of a VCR (all we had back then) and whether other things I saw were live. I honestly thought they’d think they found some idiot who was making things up and discount everything, and that they’d never ask me a second time, but I guess I was wrong. In fact, they must have been impressed with my meticulousness because about a year later, they called to ask me to take part again. But by then, I’d found work at a local TV station and was automatically disqualified.
But for one brief shining moment, I was a so-called “Nielsen” family. And I ruled the airwaves.
(Of course, I didn’t. But it was fun to think my choices might help keep a show on the air, even if Canadians have no effect on what the U.S. networks do.)
My friend has promised to keep me informed about his radio diary escapade. If he sends me anything interesting, I’ll post it here.
Last edited by RadioActive (March 8, 2016 9:17 pm)
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Interesting thread RA.
Many years ago I received a ballot too...
You should have seen my colleagues and bosses eyes "light up" when I told them !!
Naturally I was totally impartial when I filled it out....(I was laughing out loud as I typed that).
I also know of a former radio executive who was censured when he was found to have "purchased" a ballot from someone. The phony s.o.b. then left radio went into civic politics !!
Fits no ??
I guess some folks just have short memories.
With so many having given up landlines in favor of cell fones which are usually not listed anywhere, how does Numeris select its sample of typical listeners to call and ask if they will participate?
People who live in a crappy house that looks like the occupants could use $2?
And as much radio listening is now done in moving vehicles where the selection button is hit each time a commercial comes on, how valid can a handwritten diary be?
Last edited by geo (March 9, 2016 7:16 am)
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i've received 3 calls so far (here in whitby). after some discussion, they concluded that i'm "still involved in the business" (I still voice spots plus i do buy radio/tv airtime for clients, from time to time). i must admit, i was tempted...(toonie et al).
Diary ratings are ever so easily skewed...especially in smaller markets. I doubt that they're accurate EVER. Tomfoolery in a diary...and millions get spent as a result of this on-going hocus pocus...'cause it's all they have. The number of books which make their way onto a management desk only to be filled out along the company line is just SO dishonest... ... ...and normal.
And you know what? Those sudden jumps and drops that stations take...even when the ratings company attempts to smooth it out some...are still plainly visible. THOSE companies CAN'T be trusted with anyone's advertising dollars and should be avoided like the plague.
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Even when the ratings people check for potential candidates it doesn't stop said candidate from lying to them or management from getting a call from someone who needs some 'help' filling out their book. Unscrupulous GMs/PDs can be counted on to foul the whole 'thing' toward the garbage. BUT it never actually gets tossed out does it?
Last edited by Old Codger (March 9, 2016 3:30 pm)
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My friend finally got his official diary in the mail on Monday and wrote me the following email. He's given me permission to share it here.
"It's here. Or at least it will be. The survey lasts a week and officially starts on March 28th. So all PDs and Brand Managers should take note and put on their best programming that week!
In case you've never seen a real diary, let me describe it. There are at least seven pages of questions about where I work, how much I make, where I shop, how often, my online listening habits, whether I have a satellite radio subscription, and more. What I find most intriguing are the specific industries or services they hone in on for my demo, asking the kind of car I drive, where I get it serviced, if I have a cell phone and whether that plan has been changed in the last year, and on and on it goes. Pretty nosy if I do say so myself!
But what really surprised me is a page that asks you to fill in the list of radio stations you've heard that week. There’s only six spaces! I’m hardly the average listener, I’ll admit, but I tune in to dozens of different stations every week and six won’t even come close to covering it. Not only that, but they ask you to list the call letters of each one.
That’s not a problem for me, but with so many stations dropping their calls for brand identifiers, I wonder how many people even know what they are. Do you think the average diary-filler knows that Boom is CHBM, or Indie 88.1 is CIND? And would they bother trying to find out? I’m sure Numeris is well aware of it and compensates when someone writes in “Flow.” (Or is it now “Move?”) Anyway, seems limited to me. Not to mention what happens if a person accidentally writes in the wrong station, with so many of them having the same playlists.
Then there’s the actual diary itself, which is measured in 14 minute increments. You’re supposed to list that entire time period, even if you’ve only tuned in for five minutes. What it doesn’t say is how to fill it out if you’re an inveterate button pusher like me, who constantly switches stations and rarely stays in one place for five minutes!
And to my complete non-surprise, the diary re-emphasizes how unimportant the late shifts are. They don’t care about anything that airs between 1 am and 5 am. Which certainly explains much of the overnight syndicated or automated programming that occupies most stations these days. They also ask you to list where you’re listening (home, work, car or other.)
But perhaps what really bugs me most is there’s no more loonies or twonies included with the thing anymore. Considering how much actual work this is, at least they should give you something for your trouble!
So that’s my early diary experience. You said you wanted an update my old friend and now you know more than you probably wanted to! I only hope I can actually keep up with the thing. Until then, GTA radio stations beware. I’m armed with a Numeris diary and I know how to use it!”
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If there's more to come, I'll let you know.
Last edited by RadioActive (March 21, 2016 11:59 am)
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My friend with the Numeris diary promises not to overload me (and by extension readers of this board) with emails, but he’s sent another and it raises some interesting questions about the accuracy of ratings. Here’s what he said:
“Sorry to bug you again, but I thought I’d share a weird conversation I had with a spokesperson at Numeris today, when I called to ask a question about filling out this diary. The entire thing has left me wondering about how accurate they really are.
Here’s why.
The document is divided into quarter hours, and asks that you indicate which station you listened to for at least five minutes or longer. Right there I wonder how fair that is. But then I asked this. “What if I listen to several stations in that 15 minute increment, jumping from one to another because I don’t like a song, an ad comes on or a talk radio topic doesn’t interest me? So I’m with station A for two minutes, switch to station B for two and a half and then go to station C for a couple of minutes thereafter? The diary doesn’t allow that to be specifically marked, instead restricting you to just one station for that 15 minute time period.”
Her answer surprised me. “Just enter the one you listened to the longest,” she replied.
Really? So CHUM-FM gets credit for being my listening choice because I heard it 30 secs. longer than CHFI? Or CFRB goes to a break and I switch over to AM 640 while 1010 is running four minutes of spots and they win that time period?
If this is how they measure who wins and loses, I feel sorry for all stations involved. It leads me to believe that the system is exceedingly flawed and frankly, though I’m participating in it, seeing it from this side, I no longer believe the numbers can possibly be trustworthy.
I was always suspicious of diaries. Now I’m sure they’re the worst possible way to do this. The diary also asks you to take it with you wherever you go for the week. I’m skeptical as to how many people would actually do this, but it prompted me to ask her how you’re supposed to fill that out with any accuracy when you’re listening to the radio while driving a car.
Talk about a recipe for distracted driving! Are you supposed to scrawl the station you’re listening to as you try to avoid that semi on the 401? Or are you somehow supposed to remember what you were listening to and then write it down when you get back home?
My rating period hasn’t even started yet and already I think there’s a lot of doubt in the process. And careers and millions of dollars are riding on this???? Wow.
One more thing – there’s a section at the end of the diary where participants can enter comments about what they liked and what they hated about a radio’s programming. The Numeris woman insists program directors read these things and take them seriously. Which leads me to wonder: what would you say if you had the ear of these people?
Effective or not, this is going to be a fun week!"
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It’s been a while since I heard from my retired radio friend who finally got a Numeris diary to fill out. They must have liked what he did because the company sent him a follow-up survey, with a long list of questions. But there’s one in particular that struck him as odd. I’ll let him tell you about it.
This thing is a literal book. It’s 86 f-ing pages! No one in their right mind would take the enormous amount of time it takes to fill it out. But since I’ve never been in my right mind, I naturally did it. When I received the original diary, I got nothing for my trouble. This time, they sent a crisp $5 bill inside, to try to guilt me into doing it. Since that was more than I made at some stations I’ve worked at, I decided to take the money and run!
The survey asks a lot of typical consumer demographic questions, including whether you frequent restaurants or go to concerts and how often, what products you use, which stores you go to etc. The long form census isn’t so detailed.
But there was one part that captured my already limited attention. The original ratings diary instructed users to only input what they listened to between 6 A.M. and 1 A.M. After that, they didn’t care. But this one paid special attention to the early morning hours, asking “how many hours do you listen to the radio between 1 A.M. and 5 A.M.?” on weekdays and then on weekends. At first I thought it was a misprint.
I actually called their special helpline to find out if there was a mistake. The guy answered the phone “hello?” instead of “Numeris” and frankly, I didn’t think I had the right number. But he finally confessed he worked for the firm and told me that, yes that WAS the question.
When I asked why they were suddenly paying attention to the middle of the night graveyard shift, he didn’t know. But there it was. There were also TV related viewing queries and many of those were about the wee hours, as well.
Why would they suddenly care about the hours of radio which are unrated and for the most part filled with syndicated or repeat rerolls? Very weird.
The only thing I refused to answer were the questions about how much I made, how much my investments were worth, what was the estimated value of my house and that kind of thing. It’s bad enough I have to tell the government once every April. It’s none of their business and I told them so, suggesting a “prefer not to answer” box be placed onto future surveys.
They said they’d consider it, which means it will never happen!
Well, that’s probably the end of my adventures in ratings land. But it sure was fun while it lasted! And I made five bucks on the thing, too!”
grilled.cheese wrote:
Old people like filling out check boxes and what not
"Don't trust anyone under thirty"