The Southern Ontario/WNY Radio-TV Forum » CJRU: Ryerson radio

Hansa · August 9, 2021 8:54 am

Does anyone ever listen to Ryerson's AM station (1280)? I live downtown and can barely pick it up! It's a shame because it's avoided the governance issues and internal factionalism that killed CKLN but I doubt more than a few dozen people listen to it OTA (perhaps a few hundred online?). Perhaps, given Ryerson's relationship with Rogers, Rogers would be willing to set aside one of KISS or CHFI's HD channel's for Ryerson - it would be a good gesture in "corporate social responsibility" as well as a way for them to help incubate new talent, both musically and on-air and behind the scenes - and hopefully if HD ever picks up in this country, it'll give CJRU a wider audience. Otherwise, I don't see the station likely to get an FM license anytime soon given the crowding on the dial.

Last edited by Hansa (August 9, 2021 10:07 am)

radiokid · August 9, 2021 9:22 am

Q and Edge, Rogers does not own... It's Corus. Both are on the CN Tower, so both are highly unlikely to be in HD for a while.

I have a feeling any company will be hesitant to share their HD signals because of who technically becomes responsible should programming go off the rails. Who's license is responsible? It would be better off if CJRU applied for a power increase and or add HD to their current signal. Another option would be teaming up with UofT's station 89.5, and get on their HD once it's launched. They both are similar licenses, and a reasonable signal.

I just don't see a business case or a legal case for a commercial station to get involved here, but for sure something like UofT could.

Last edited by radiokid (August 9, 2021 9:27 am)

Hansa · August 9, 2021 10:07 am

radiokid wrote:
Q and Edge, Rogers does not own... It's Corus. Both are on the CN Tower, so both are highly unlikely to be in HD for a while.

Ugh, sorry that was a mental lapse on my part, I was mixing up Rogers and Corus for some reason. I meant CHFI and KISS.

Radiowiz · August 9, 2021 10:08 am

If Rogers could give even a slight ounce of care for CJRU, the absolute least they can do it add it to the blue screen digital channel radio line up on the digital box. (ie my Nextbox)
HOWEVER
I have no idea if the new Ignite TV has such a feature, so my point is kinda moot in 2021.

Hansa · August 9, 2021 10:11 am

radiokid wrote:
It would be better off if CJRU applied for a power increase and or add HD to their current signal. Another option would be teaming up with UofT's station 89.5, and get on their HD once it's launched. They both are similar licenses, and a reasonable signal.

I just don't see a business case or a legal case for a commercial station to get involved here, but for sure something like UofT could.

That might be more realistic. I know CIUT had a real financial crunch a few years ago after their previous station manager was fired for financial chicanery. Perhaps if Ryerson could throw in some money to help launch CIUT's HD in exchange for use of one of CIUT's HD channels?

radiokid · August 9, 2021 10:15 am

Radiowiz wrote:
If Rogers could give even a slight ounce of care for CJRU, the absolute least they can do it add it to the blue screen digital channel radio line up on the digital box. (ie my Nextbox)
HOWEVER
I have no idea if the new Ignite TV has such a feature, so my point is kinda moot in 2021.

That's a legacy cable thing. To my understanding Ignite drops most of those graphic only channels (and there really is no need for them today in 2021)

RadioActive · August 9, 2021 10:36 am

CJRU is such a low power station, I can barely hear it here in Northern North York. It's mostly just static, but you can tell there's something at 1280. The station has a website that lists its programming (and you can listen online if you want) but it should surprise no one that it's not exactly my cup of audio tea. I believe it's meant to be a campus-only station for the most part and in that, at least, it succeeds.

They appear to be looking for volunteers to help run the place, but there's no sign of any plans to boost power or partner with anyone. I suppose it's better than the RTA of old, which had no licence and was literally broadcasting to one or two rooms closed circuit within the college. (It was a college then. It's a university now.)

They're trying to raise money by seeking donations or selling swag, like the T-shirt below. But unless people can hear them, it's going to stay very local. I wish them luck and I'm sure it's a good place to learn about the biz. But I can't help but wonder if even those who go there ever bother to listen to a weak AM signal. Especially in that age group.

tvguy · August 9, 2021 10:36 am

Susan Wheeler of Rogers, recently wrote to the CRTC, in the context of the Commercial Radio Review, and told them Rogers would not be pursuing IBOC HD in the future. Might be posturing on the part of Rogers, because they have already committed to HD in several markets. Whether they will "pay" for the CN Tower upgrade and upgrade/add IBOC to their CHFI transmitter, remains to be seen. Rogers might have simply been trying to change the 2-to-an-owner FM ownership policy. There are stations on FCP who have some HD capacity. The difficulty is the cost and perhaps the lost business opportunity of giving up a an HD subcarrier. FCP (Brookfield) charges its FM broadcast tenants who use an HD2, HD3 or HD4 subcarrier, a "per subcarrier" fee that is around $18,000 per annum per channel. That's horribbly steep for a campus station, plus the encoder costs, licence fees to Ibiquity (or whatever the venture capital firm is now called) who license the Ibiquity software.

It is unknown whether CN Tower's owners will impose a steep surcharge. Scott Fybush knows of no situation in the U.S. where a tower owner imposes an HD penalty/surcharge.

Radiowiz · August 9, 2021 10:45 am

tvguy wrote:
Rogers might have simply been trying to change the 2-to-an-owner FM ownership policy.

I'm not sure about Rogers, but, clear as day, Bell DID try to get the CRTC to change the rules to allow 3 AM and 3 FM instead of the current two and two when they bought the Astral Media stations.
CRTC refused to give in. It never happened.

Skywave · August 9, 2021 11:28 am

CJRU is limited to 99 watts at night, which being under 100 watts classifies it as low power. Therefore it hasn't been notified to the FCC. That said, it should be protecting WHTK 1280 Rochester, but at 99 watts it doesn't really. The incoming skywave interference to CJRU at night is brutal and makes reception futile even in most of the downtown core.

tvguy · August 9, 2021 11:33 am

Radiowiz wrote:
tvguy wrote:
Rogers might have simply been trying to change the 2-to-an-owner FM ownership policy.
I'm not sure about Rogers, but, clear as day, Bell DID try to get the CRTC to change the rules to allow 3 AM and 3 FM instead of the current two and two when they bought the Astral Media stations.
CRTC refused to give in. It never happened.

Rogers was a member of the CAB, and here is what Rogers/CAB told the CRTC in their (recent) filing on the review of the Commercial radio policy on March 29, 2021Common Ownership Policy (COP)In markets with eight (8) or fewer commercial stations operating in a given language, a person may be permitted to own or control as many as four (4) stations operating in that language.
In markets with between nine (9) and sixteen (16) commercial stations operating in a given language, a person may be permitted to own or control as many as six (6) stations operating in that language, provided that the person does not own or control more than 50 percent of all stations operating in that language.
In markets with sixteen (16) commercial stations or more operating in a given language, a person may be permitted to own or control as many as eight (8) stations operating in that language.

tvguy · August 9, 2021 11:34 am

Radiowiz wrote:
tvguy wrote:
Rogers might have simply been trying to change the 2-to-an-owner FM ownership policy.
I'm not sure about Rogers, but, clear as day, Bell DID try to get the CRTC to change the rules to allow 3 AM and 3 FM instead of the current two and two when they bought the Astral Media stations.
CRTC refused to give in. It never happened.

Rogers was a member of the CAB, and here is what Rogers/CAB told the CRTC in their (recent) filing on the review of the Commercial radio policy on March 29, 2021Common Ownership Policy (COP)In markets with eight (8) or fewer commercial stations operating in a given language, a person may be permitted to own or control as many as four (4) stations operating in that language.
In markets with between nine (9) and sixteen (16) commercial stations operating in a given language, a person may be permitted to own or control as many as six (6) stations operating in that language, provided that the person does not own or control more than 50 percent of all stations operating in that language.
In markets with sixteen (16) commercial stations or more operating in a given language, a person may be permitted to own or control as many as eight (8) stations operating in that language.

Rogers in their parallel filing, at paragraph 77 quoted the CAB propoosal word-for-word and indicated that that was their position

Last edited by tvguy (August 9, 2021 11:41 am)

RadioAaron · August 9, 2021 5:51 pm

tvguy wrote:
Susan Wheeler of Rogers, recently wrote to the CRTC, in the context of the Commercial Radio Review, and told them Rogers would not be pursuing IBOC HD in the future. Might be posturing on the part of Rogers, because they have already committed to HD in several markets. Whether they will "pay" for the CN Tower upgrade and upgrade/add IBOC to their CHFI transmitter, remains to be seen.

They haven't really "committed" to HD in several markets; they turned it on when it was young, simulcast some AMs, and never talked about it again. HD isn't coming to CHFI - there's no point.

Hansa · August 9, 2021 8:19 pm

Is there enough room for CJRU to move to an adjacent freqency to either CIUT 89.5 or the other university station, CHRY at 105.5?

Radio.Intern · August 9, 2021 8:33 pm

Just want to add some insight into this from the volunteering side: I'm currently a CJRU volunteer, and have been for coming up on 4 years. I've loved every minute of being a volunteer there (and I'm not being paid to say this, lol). Those that work/volunteer at CJRU are a fantastic bunch, give you plenty of creative reigns as long as you put in the work for your show & stick to station rules/regulations, and I've learned so much.

In terms of our AM coverage, yup it's not great.... at all. I know in the past there's been surveys done on how volunteers and the greater Ryerson community listens to CJRU, and the response has consistently been online. Even if we were to get a signal boost, I don't think it would make much of an impact on our listenership, given the station's audience who are online listeners by nature. Maybe a move to FM would help our over the air audience, but again, given our demo, cost, and where we stand in the radio landscape: online is best.

I also know CJRU has been looking into getting online listenership numbers per show (something many volunteers including myself would love to see), but it is costly, so I'm not sure whether it will come into fruition. Overall, I'm just thankful for the opportunity to make radio at Ryerson. Every university/college should have a campus radio station no matter how big or small.

DOPEfm · August 9, 2021 9:30 pm

I listen from Hamilton to CJRU occasionally. At night is brutal and weak, daytime is fair most days.

I am using a Sangean HD AM/FM digital tuner which also helps. (Can receive 530 new HD clearly)

On the subject of broadcast HD AM in general, it does help reception and listening area. The sound is fairly close to FM. Using AM HD hybrid seems to be the best option, as you still have the analog signal in addition to the HD.

It's a shame CJRU couldn't have 250 watts (day and night), this way the listenability of the signal would be somewhat better in the core area of Toronto, and perhaps better for fringe listeners like myself (the transmitter is near the pier in downtown east if I'm correct)