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September 16, 2019 12:55 pm  #61


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Bristol wrote:

Both applications CIRR-FM 2018-0285-1  and CIDC-FM 2018-0286-9  are on the CRTC Site as Closed Part 1 applications...that means active in the process and not withdrawn. The files are still awaiting a Commission decision. 

I think it's debatable whether this inordinate amount of time to render a decision is in the public's interest. Is this a protectionist tactic? I think we'll have our answer when the decision is eventually rendered.

Last edited by Tim Brown 2016 (September 16, 2019 2:27 pm)

 

September 16, 2019 5:19 pm  #62


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

If I were Evanov I'd offer CIUT a lot of cash to swap frequencies. The station was in serious debt a few years ago after their (now former) station manager allegedly embezzled over $150,000 and they'll likely lose much of their budget due to Ford's "student choice initiative" so I think they'd find a large infusion of cash for a frequency swap very tempting.

 

January 24, 2020 8:20 pm  #63


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

CRTC Decision to (finally) be released by next Friday at 11 am.Dufferin Communications Inc.
CIRR-FM Toronto and CIDC-FM Orangeville – Technical changes
Public record for these applications: 2018-0285-1 and 2018-0286-9 Decision relating to the following application announced in Broadcasting Notice of Consultation 2019-225:

 

January 24, 2020 8:53 pm  #64


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

The amount of time they've sat on this is completely unfair to everyone involved.


 
 

January 25, 2020 6:48 pm  #65


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Radiowiz wrote:

Pride FM is no more. Evanov group has switched CIRR to the ALL NEW PROUD FM effective immediately. 
Source:  http://proudfm.com/  

Hmmm. I wonder if this move has anything to do with what's happening at the CRTC in the coming week. After such a long delay, this is on the docket for the Commission sometime between next Monday and the following Friday.

From the CRTC website about anticipated broadcasting decisions:

Dufferin Communications Inc.
CIRR-FM Toronto and CIDC-FM Orangeville – Technical changes
Public record for these applications: 2018-0285-1 and 2018-0286-9 


Seems we may finally get an answer to this long running mystery. 

     Thread Starter
 

January 25, 2020 7:12 pm  #66


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

RadioActive wrote:

Radiowiz wrote:

Pride FM is no more. Evanov group has switched CIRR to the ALL NEW PROUD FM effective immediately. 
Source:  http://proudfm.com/  

Hmmm. I wonder if this move has anything to do with what's happening at the CRTC in the coming week.

It doesn't. Radiowiz used the term "effective immediately" for no good reason; the station has been Proud FM since launch. He's just making stuff up, as usual.
 

Last edited by RadioAaron (January 25, 2020 7:20 pm)


 
 

January 25, 2020 7:31 pm  #67


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Still, it will be interesting to see how the CRTC rules.

     Thread Starter
 

January 25, 2020 7:36 pm  #68


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

You're OK with him picking minor irrelevant errors, and correcting them as though it's new information that he's just presented? Because it happens a lot.


 
 

January 25, 2020 8:05 pm  #69


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

I do this part time and it's impossible to keep on top of everything that happens in this market, but what I find is that generally there is someone - like yourself - who will set the record straight if someone posts any incorrect info. (And some take great glee in doing so.) 

Still, it seems plausible there could be some changes at both Pride and Z103.5 if the CRTC says yes to their rather unusual proposal in the coming week. 

If this is that frequency switching decision, I personally hope the Commission says no. The Evanovs have been playing around the edges with their radio stations for a long time, always trying to find a way to get into the Toronto market, even while ignoring their area of licence. That doesn't deserve to be rewarded, but I do give them credit of sorts for coming up with such a novel idea.

     Thread Starter
 

January 25, 2020 11:43 pm  #70


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

RadioActive wrote:

I do this part time and it's impossible to keep on top of everything that happens in this market, but what I find is that generally there is someone - like yourself - who will set the record straight if someone posts any incorrect info. (And some take great glee in doing so.) 

Still, it seems plausible there could be some changes at both Pride and Z103.5 if the CRTC says yes to their rather unusual proposal in the coming week. 

If this is that frequency switching decision, I personally hope the Commission says no. The Evanovs have been playing around the edges with their radio stations for a long time, always trying to find a way to get into the Toronto market, even while ignoring their area of licence. That doesn't deserve to be rewarded, but I do give them credit of sorts for coming up with such a novel idea.

That's great, but where DO you get Pride FM from anyway?

 

January 25, 2020 11:44 pm  #71


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

RadioAaron wrote:


It doesn't. Radiowiz used the term "effective immediately" for no good reason; the station has been Proud FM since launch. He's just making stuff up, as usual.  
You're OK with him picking minor irrelevant errors, and correcting them as though it's new information that he's just presented? Because it happens a lot.

You are a good liar sir. Simply for saying stuff like it happens a lot and as usual. I believe you have me confused with someone else, and I SURE DO NOT appreciate you defending the subject line.
Especially since you seem to KNOW how long it has been PROUD fm for. 
If anything, you HAD your chance to correct it LONG before now. You did not.

Last edited by Radiowiz (January 26, 2020 5:44 am)

 

January 31, 2020 11:20 am  #72


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

And the final? answer is - DENIED
https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2020/2020-39.htm

 

January 31, 2020 11:43 am  #73


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

This reminds me of the lyrics to Badfinger’s “Baby Blue” that aired in the final episode of “Breaking Bad.”
 
“Guess I got what I deserved.”
 
I have no skin in the game with Dufferin Communications, having never worked there and barely listened to their stations. But this is yet the latest attempt by them to circumvent the licence requirements they readily agreed to in order to get these stations on the air.
 
And while I’m no fan of the CRTC, I’m pleased to see they didn’t let them get away with it – again. There is a lot to digest in the decision but a few things stand out for me.
 
-According to the Commission, the change of CIDC from 103.5 to 103.7 “would result in a decrease in the size of its service contour, approval of those changes would result in a service contour that would no longer include the GTA but, instead, be limited to the Orangeville radio market.”
 
Frankly, this surprises me, given how hard they tried to reach the Toronto market in past attempts.
 
-It would appear the real goal here was to increase both the power and range of CIRR, aka ProudFM. But despite claiming that high rises and other obstacles were blocking their current signal, “it did not submit any evidence of signal reception issues….In the Commission’s view, the licensee has therefore not provided sufficient evidence to demonstrate that CIRR-FM’s signal is inadequate to provide service within its authorized service contours.”
 
Wow. You might think they would have at least gone to the trouble (read expense) to try and get that nailed down before making the request. Guess not. Small wonder the CRTC didn’t buy it.
 
-Perhaps my favourite effort which says, in effect, “Hey, if you give us these changes then we can use it to prop up some of our more struggling stations in smaller markets.” The CRTC response is classic. “The Commission…generally does not consider support for out-of-market radio stations a compelling reason to approve those technical changes.”
 
And as for claims that they're not doing so well, the Commission acknowledges that the stations in question are experiencing some financial issues, but “Dufferin has not demonstrated that the requested technical changes are required to maintain the services’ viability.”
 
-Finally, they couldn’t even get something simple and easy like HD right. They wanted to try the subcarrier route and here they have a Commission that’s sympathetic to those efforts. But they didn’t even bother to file an application for permission to start it. Still, the CRTC “encourages them to proceed” with any future proposals. so maybe at least they'll get that one day.
 
So is this over at last? I wonder. This isn’t Dufferin’s first bite at this apple. I suspect they’re processing this decision and they’ll be back before long looking for another way to beat the system. So far, every gamble has been a loss.

     Thread Starter
 

January 31, 2020 11:51 am  #74


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Also interesting to see how many Interventions were filed on these applications. It's quite a list. 

Corus, Bell Media, Rogers, the folks from MyFM, Brock University Student Radio, licensee of the English-language campus/community radio station CFBU-FM St. Catharines, the National Campus and Community Radio Association, and Bayshore Broadcasting Corporation, which owns CFDC-FM Shelburne. Also opposition from an "individual." Not sure who that might have been, but I assure you, it wasn't me!

     Thread Starter
 

January 31, 2020 12:05 pm  #75


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Reading all the way to the bottom, on the specific matter of HD Radio, the CRTC explicitly says it has no formal application process yet for HD Radio. So it's hard to see how Evanov could have "bother(ed) to file an application," in that case. 

 

January 31, 2020 12:07 pm  #76


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

My best guess - perhaps influenced by the length of time the request took before the CRTC, was they were going to get some kind of perhaps compromise here and the CRTC needed the time to come up with something. Ah, to be a fly on the wall if there were discussions going back and forth during the process. Obviously, with the number of intervenors and other issues, it was a complex case. That obviously would account for the time taken. But I thought a basic No would have come just a little faster. I would imagine 103.9 will stay as is. But wonder about 103.5 - do they have enough https://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons3/heart.png
 for Orangeville?

 

January 31, 2020 12:43 pm  #77


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

fybush wrote:

Reading all the way to the bottom, on the specific matter of HD Radio, the CRTC explicitly says it has no formal application process yet for HD Radio. So it's hard to see how Evanov could have "bother(ed) to file an application," in that case. 

Yeah, that's my bad. What I meant to say is that they've expressed an interest in HD but obviously haven't done anything about it. Which just makes it worse. The one thing they don't need permission for and they haven't done it.

So where would their potential HD signals wind up? 103.5? My suggestion would be 88.5, the Jewel, which may have better reach in the GTA. Pride could go at HD1, with Z103.5 on HD2. That would finally allow them to get farther into Toronto, which has been their goal all along. Too bad so few have HD-capable radios these days.

     Thread Starter
 

January 31, 2020 1:09 pm  #78


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

The tying in of HD into this application was really more of a cover to say they would keep Proud on the air than a real step into that arena; a political move they hoped would help pass it.

They do have Z on 92.1 HD, and they could do 88.5 too, I agree, but it would probably make little to no difference in Z's future.

As for 103.9, I wouldn't be shocked if they just shut it off.  A little conspiracy minded, but I never thought it was anything but a placeholder to help Z move into the city following a regulation change or a clever application. 


 
 

January 31, 2020 1:38 pm  #79


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Not surprised.  Only surprised it took so long and kind of anxious to see their next application however, I dont see the point.  Id be more embarrased now if I was Evanov to keep trying for the same reason.

Doing HD as subcarrier would be worse on Jewel as the signal doesnt make it in as good as Z.   To be honest, Z doesnt have that bad of a coverage in Toronto.  Is it good quality?...no it suffers from a lot of a weird static but one of those stations that for the most part (south of the 401 for the most part) , your seek button in the car will always land on it despite being at times static.

Perhaps a rebranding is best now 
 

Last edited by markow202 (January 31, 2020 1:42 pm)

 

January 31, 2020 6:55 pm  #80


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

It's also bad in-building south of the 401 - which granted, means less and less by the day, but it's still important for now.

As for re-branding, I'd go a step further and suggest format change. Given where its signal is best, I'd go Country. I know the KX's virtually cover the market from each end and market as "GTA" they both sound quite local to their markets. Neither participate in Numeris in Toronto. Country on 103.5 coming from north of the city with a modern, GTA-centric (with Orangeville Leagal IDs of course) could work.

Z did best in Toronto when there was a local CHR hole. With KiSS and Virgin at each other with Rogers and Bell behind them, there's not much room.

I know all the "Evanov" reasons for this to not happen, but still....they need to make money.


 
 

January 31, 2020 8:26 pm  #81


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

RadioAaron wrote:

As for re-branding, I'd go a step further and suggest format change. Given where its signal is best, I'd go Country. I know the KX's virtually cover the market from each end and market as "GTA" they both sound quite local to their markets. Neither participate in Numeris in Toronto. Country on 103.5 coming from north of the city with a modern, GTA-centric (with Orangeville Leagal IDs of course) could work.

Z did best in Toronto when there was a local CHR hole. With KiSS and Virgin at each other with Rogers and Bell behind them, there's not much room.

I know all the "Evanov" reasons for this to not happen, but still....they need to make money.

You do make some excellent points RadioAaron, but instead of Country, why not go all wayback playback all the time? There are a lot of exclusive tracks only Z103 played back in the day that may be of interest to the ear today.  
 

 

January 31, 2020 10:18 pm  #82


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

RadioAaron wrote:

It's also bad in-building south of the 401 - which granted, means less and less by the day, but it's still important for now.

As for re-branding, I'd go a step further and suggest format change. Given where its signal is best, I'd go Country. I know the KX's virtually cover the market from each end and market as "GTA" they both sound quite local to their markets. Neither participate in Numeris in Toronto. Country on 103.5 coming from north of the city with a modern, GTA-centric (with Orangeville Leagal IDs of course) could work.

Z did best in Toronto when there was a local CHR hole. With KiSS and Virgin at each other with Rogers and Bell behind them, there's not much room.

I know all the "Evanov" reasons for this to not happen, but still....they need to make money.

I’m not sure if country format is really viable for Z103.5, as the KX Country stations from Hamilton and Ajax aren’t receiving too much audience in the Toronto area proper. Guess the city folks aren’t really into country music a lot, it might even be a revenue loss if they turn 103.5 into a country station. Z103.5 is already good at it’s format right now, with a heavily rhythmic CHR sound, albeit after one and a half year their proposal is again rejected...

Guess the Evanov Radio Group will come up with a new proposal at sometime in the future, figuring how they can persuade CRTC that they have a ‘compelling’ need for turning Z into a Toronto station. It might take years again though...

 

February 1, 2020 12:10 am  #83


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

RadioAaron wrote:

The tying in of HD into this application was really more of a cover to say they would keep Proud on the air than a real step into that arena; a political move they hoped would help pass it.

They do have Z on 92.1 HD, and they could do 88.5 too, I agree, but it would probably make little to no difference in Z's future.

As for 103.9, I wouldn't be shocked if they just shut it off.  A little conspiracy minded, but I never thought it was anything but a placeholder to help Z move into the city following a regulation change or a clever application. 

They could a Hybrid. Call it Dynamic with Hot AC and Country. It worked for a week at one time and was unique under the archaic rules in the 90's.

 

 

February 1, 2020 6:26 pm  #84


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Adrian106072 wrote:

I’m not sure if country format is really viable for Z103.5, as the KX Country stations from Hamilton and Ajax aren’t receiving too much audience in the Toronto area proper. Guess the city folks aren’t really into country music a lot, it might even be a revenue loss if they turn 103.5 into a country station. Z103.5 is already good at it’s format right now, with a heavily rhythmic CHR sound, albeit after one and a half year their proposal is again rejected...

We don't know how much audience the KX's are getting in Toronto as they're not rated or marketed here, and it's not about the city folks, it's about the suburbs and other smaller communities that still make up the CMA. Z103 may be "good at its format", but the numbers aren't there anymore.


 
 

February 1, 2020 6:30 pm  #85


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Radiowiz wrote:

RadioAaron wrote:

As for re-branding, I'd go a step further and suggest format change. Given where its signal is best, I'd go Country. I know the KX's virtually cover the market from each end and market as "GTA" they both sound quite local to their markets. Neither participate in Numeris in Toronto. Country on 103.5 coming from north of the city with a modern, GTA-centric (with Orangeville Leagal IDs of course) could work.

Z did best in Toronto when there was a local CHR hole. With KiSS and Virgin at each other with Rogers and Bell behind them, there's not much room.

I know all the "Evanov" reasons for this to not happen, but still....they need to make money.

You do make some excellent points RadioAaron, but instead of Country, why not go all wayback playback all the time? There are a lot of exclusive tracks only Z103 played back in the day that may be of interest to the ear today.  
 

That would probably work initially; the challenge is maintaining it, as 93.5 learned. You can't go wide (like adult hits) or deep (like classic rock) so it tends to burn pretty quick. 


 
 

February 1, 2020 6:36 pm  #86


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

A lot of CIDC's coverage area is already served by Bayshore's Shelburne Country 105 station which has fairly good coverage - all the way to Airport Road/Steeles.  So there's probably little to no revenue in the Orangeville market for a 2nd country station.  So, they would be nibbling at the extremities of the GTA if CIDC changed format to country.   Probably far less revenue available to support the country format, than their current format.  Besides that, the KX stations do a pretty good job of being "local" stations.  Would GTA listeners embrace an Evanov country station as their "local" country music choice?  Probably not.  Besides Kirk's KX 96 has a pretty good signal downtown and throughout the City of Toronto, from their First Canadian Place (synchronous) repeater.  It's signal isn't particularly good in Etobicoke, but KX 94.7 from Hamilton booms into that area, as well as Mississauga, in HD.
 

Last edited by tvguy (February 1, 2020 6:38 pm)

 

February 1, 2020 7:06 pm  #87


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

Their current format is also available locally everywhere their signal reaches.

The difference being the CHRs are catered to and rated in the CMA. Don't underestimate the power of content targeting and marketing. 


 
 

February 3, 2020 10:30 am  #88


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

I tuned in to Z and their in between song station ID's is "Z1035 Orangeville, playing all the hits"  lol I found it humerous as the "O word"  never existed until now.  

 

February 3, 2020 10:37 am  #89


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

markow202 wrote:

I tuned in to Z and their in between song station ID's is "Z1035 Orangeville, playing all the hits"  lol I found it humerous as the "O word"  never existed until now.  

This is the result of a CRTC order that came down in late 2017. As it became evident that Orangeville was non-existent in their imaging (although it's their area of licence) the Commission came down hard on them for ignoring it.

It was quite remarkable and was detailed on SOWNY here.  

     Thread Starter
 

February 3, 2020 11:35 am  #90


Re: The Evanovs’ Latest Plan: Switch Pride FM To 103.5 & CIDC To 103.7

RadioActive wrote:

markow202 wrote:

I tuned in to Z and their in between song station ID's is "Z1035 Orangeville, playing all the hits"  lol I found it humerous as the "O word"  never existed until now.  

This is the result of a CRTC order that came down in late 2017. As it became evident that Orangeville was non-existent in their imaging (although it's their area of licence) the Commission came down hard on them for ignoring it.

It was quite remarkable and was detailed on SOWNY here.  

Yes this I know.