sowny.net | The Southern Ontario/WNY Radio-TV Forum


You are not logged in. Would you like to login or register?

February 13, 2020 8:15 pm  #1


Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

There are two major Buffalo stations left that have yet to go to their new reassigned channels. According to the FCC, WKBW, the ABC affiliate and WNED, the PBS outlet, will be heading to their new positions sometime on March 13, a month from today as I post this. (Note: if you're using the link above, you'll have to enter the zip code to see all the changes. Use "14202" for Buffalo and hit "Submit.")

'KB will be going from Channel 38 to Channel 34, while WNED will migrate from channel 43 over to 31. When it happens, you'll need to rescan for these stations to keep getting them. With luck, the weather will cooperate.  

The FCC says the stations should start airing on air reminders about the change as the date draws near.

I've been having horrible troubles with both signals for months. Hopefully, reception in the GTA will vastly improve after the moves and whatever power changes are scheduled are completed. This should be the last of what has been a very busy time for TV outlets on both sides of the border.    

 

February 14, 2020 2:51 pm  #2


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

This is not final Buffalo repack nor all the channels that must move by this date as per this FCC website.

 

February 14, 2020 2:52 pm  #3


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

https://www.rabbitears.info/market.php (market 54) has the complete list including the Toronto and area stations that are moving.

Last edited by Hrick (February 14, 2020 2:55 pm)

 

February 14, 2020 3:06 pm  #4


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Thanks for the update. I guess WKBW & WNED are the two I'm most worried about. The Toronto ones will almost certainly come in no matter where they go.

The point was that the moves of the major Buffalo outlets will happen on March 13th, if things stay on schedule. I'm hoping that there will be a reception improvement. I've been having issues with Channel 7 ever since the signals went digital. It's the major border station I can't count on. And lately, 17 has been AWOL more often than not. 

Maybe both changes will help but that remains to be seen. 

Or not seen, as the case may be.

I'm told the drop dead deadline for all the final changes will be July 2020.

     Thread Starter
 

February 14, 2020 4:14 pm  #5


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Never had any issue with PBS, FOX was the one that was hit and miss and now it's fine.  The 7's come and go, but mainly they are there, just weak.  CTV (CFTO) on the other hand is a complete waste of time.  Probably can tune it in 10% of the time.

 

February 14, 2020 4:20 pm  #6


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Really? CFTO? What part of the area are you in? I occasionally have issues with CBLT, which is one of the strongest signals in Toronto. Never did quite figure out why, but I have an amplifier on the antenna and I often wonder if it's just too strong for the Channel 5 signal and creating problems. Good thing is I almost never watch CBC, so I'm not missing much. 

WKBW and WNED, however, I do miss, especially in bad weather. 

     Thread Starter
 

February 14, 2020 4:43 pm  #7


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

I'm in Whitby, Manning and Anderson area (south end), can see the lake from the roof and it's a clear shot to the CN tower.  Its a UHF/VHF issue I believe.

Last edited by pinto (February 14, 2020 4:44 pm)

 

February 14, 2020 5:15 pm  #8


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

According to their website, CFTO operates at 10,200 watts which isn't very powerful for a VHF signal. Would a VHF antenna improve your reception of CFTO in Whitby? I am guessing Whitby is as far east of Toronto as Oakville is west. My parents had no trouble in Oakville with any of the Toronto stations with a UHF antenna.

 

February 14, 2020 7:13 pm  #9


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Agreed that the proper antenna is needed for receiving stations that are transmitting on (real, not virtual) VHF channels. In general, those little flat "leaf" type antennas don't do the trick very well. Rabbit ears, the old-fashioned kind, work quite well. 

I was in the GTA a month or so ago, staying with friends in deepest Etobicoke (Kipling/Rathburne), and had no trouble getting clean CFTO reception with my usual travel antenna, a Terk HDTVa. This was at more or less ground level - the CN Tower signals all came in decently, but no Buffalo or even Hamilton was coming in there. 

 

February 14, 2020 9:51 pm  #10


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

I’m in Oakville. CFTO reception not nearly as good since it changed from real channel 9 to 8. Can disappear completely when a truck drives by.

 

February 15, 2020 7:55 am  #11


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

I was told they were operating CFTO at half power and have been for a while while work was being done.  That from one of my contacts in Bell

 

February 15, 2020 6:05 pm  #12


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Two more Buffalo stations to change during repack.
WNYO-TV Channel 49 (RF) will move to Channel 16, and relocate to Grand Island.   
WBXZ-LP -"Ch 56"  which is a low powered station (15KW)  running about 12 channels including Retro TV, Buzzr, Throwback TV, DriveIn TV, Cozi TV network, will move from Channel 17 (RF) to Channel 23 (RF).  It displays as Ch. 56.  That move is being held up by some cross-border regulatory issues.   But is likely to be approved later. Their transmitter is on one of the tallest buildings in Buffalo near the Peace Bridge.
WNYO-TV is scheduled to move to ATSC-3 at some point, which would require a new receiver.  But they will be required to have a night-light signal for a few years, and that may appear as a ".3" or .4" on one of the other Buffalo stations, probably WUTV.

WNYO from Grand Island will be at 575 KW, which is significantly greater than WNED.  Their main lobe will  be in the direction of Oakville and Mississauga.  By comparison they are currently operating at 105Kw on channel 49. from a location east of Buffalo

 

February 18, 2020 1:55 pm  #13


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

fybush wrote:

Agreed that the proper antenna is needed for receiving stations that are transmitting on (real, not virtual) VHF channels. In general, those little flat "leaf" type antennas don't do the trick very well. Rabbit ears, the old-fashioned kind, work quite well. 

I was in the GTA a month or so ago, staying with friends in deepest Etobicoke (Kipling/Rathburne), and had no trouble getting clean CFTO reception with my usual travel antenna, a Terk HDTVa. This was at more or less ground level - the CN Tower signals all came in decently, but no Buffalo or even Hamilton was coming in there. 

Had that same antenna at MartinGrove and Rathburn on top floor of house, picked up all of Buffalo, Toronto Hamilton and tropo I got Rochester and Erie. 

 

 

February 23, 2020 9:36 am  #14


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

First time I've seen this. I expect if they're not running some kind of on-air warning, they will be soon. 

WKBW is changing frequencies, here's what you need to know to keep watching 7 Eyewitness News

WNED has one up, too.Rescan Day is March 13, 2020 for WNED PBS, WNED Create and WNED PBS KIDS
 

Last edited by RadioActive (February 23, 2020 9:39 am)

     Thread Starter
 

February 24, 2020 12:03 am  #15


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

I guess there has been a channel line-up change at channel 2. I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet:
https://www.wgrz.com/article/news/new-channel-lineup-on-wgrz/272952542

And how about this - also from WGRZ:
https://www.wgrz.com/video/news/how-to-rescan-your-tv-to-get-abc10/103-8285154

Good luck folks in tuning in ABC 10!
 

 

February 24, 2020 12:32 am  #16


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Hey Tardis! (Does that name mean you're bigger on the inside than on the outside?)

I checked those pages you posted and it appears they're from a while ago. The new channel line-up is from 2014, while the inexplicable ABC10 is dated 2018. 

I can't explain the second one, but the current WGRZ line-up is:

2.1 NBC and local
2.2 Antenna TV
2.3 Justice TV
2.4 Quest, a Discovery type channel.

Hopefully, they'll stick with it because it actually offers some interesting programming.

I wish Canada would take advantage of subcarriers, but of course Rogers, Bell  and Shaw don't want us using antennas to get their over-the-air stations. They want to gouge us on cable/satellite instead. So even if the CRTC approved the concept, we're never likely to see any extra content here.

     Thread Starter
 

February 24, 2020 6:09 am  #17


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Not sure why WGRZ put up a video for ABC 10 but it was meant for Northern California.


Cool Airchecks and More:
http://www.lettheuniverseanswer.com/
 

February 24, 2020 8:17 am  #18


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Fitz wrote:

Not sure why WGRZ put up a video for ABC 10 but it was meant for Northern California.

Welcome to corporate content management systems! Whatever system TEGNA (the owner of WGRZ) is using for its websites allows you to put in *any* domain name for any of their stations to any URL, and it will serve up that same page with the local station logo for that domain name.

So: 

https://www.wfaa.com/video/news/how-to-rescan-your-tv-to-get-abc10/103-8285154

is the same page, but with the WFAA Dallas logo on it. Or you can take a WGRZ news article and change the domain to, say, ABC10 from Sacramento:

https://www.abc10.com/article/life/why-wait-polish-community-celebrates-paczki-day-a-little-early/71-00ec9b06-f5ed-4e1a-a498-047053b7ca45

This also works for iHeart radio stations, among other things. 
 

 

February 24, 2020 12:35 pm  #19


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

What a dope I am. I didn't even look at the date. It came up at the top in a Google search so I figured it must be new. As to ABC10, everything is cookie cutter anymore and you do see little accidents like that, here and there on the net. Bigger on the inside than the outside...absolutely. TARDIS.

 

February 24, 2020 3:10 pm  #20


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

did CIII-DT Paris Global do their change yet?  Ive lost this channel but could be also due to winter time (toronto west end) 

 

February 24, 2020 3:28 pm  #21


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

You don't get them off of Channel 41? I think they're still there and they come in very strong. Try rescanning on that channel and see what pops in. If you're in Toronto, you shouldn't have any trouble.

     Thread Starter
 

February 24, 2020 3:58 pm  #22


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

RadioActive wrote:

You don't get them off of Channel 41? I think they're still there and they come in very strong. Try rescanning on that channel and see what pops in. If you're in Toronto, you shouldn't have any trouble.

I do get 41 yes...but for the fun of it was wondering what happened to the Paris one.  It could just be the winter weather for me.  

 

April 27, 2020 12:11 pm  #23


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Im guessing the whole repack for Toronto/WNY is been on hold due to the pandemic....? 

 

April 27, 2020 2:22 pm  #24


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

A number of people on the Buffalo, HDTV AVS Forum bulletin board have noted that the Toronto stations that are Ch 40 and above have reduced power, because one of the U.S. mobile carriers has started to use the spectrum in Western New York that is being "repurposed" as a result of the repack.  That would explain why some Big Yellow Board members are not seeing some of the stations on higher frequencies, further away from Toronto.   For those of you who are able to read a spectrum analyzer screen shot, on page 267 of the forum postings, there's a good posting of the T-Mobile LTE carrier, , and the reduced signals from the CN Tower, taken by "Videobruce" who is located in the Buffalo Area.

 

April 30, 2020 4:36 pm  #25


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Further extension to October 29, 2020 for WIVB/WNLO to build out tower and increase power.  From FCC files - letter issued April 29, 2020.

 Nexstar Broadcasting, Inc.Elizabeth Ryder545 E. John Carpenter Freeway Suite 700Irving, TX 75062Dear Licensee:In Re: Special Temporary Authority For Station WNLOBuffalo, New YorkApplication File No. 0000112769 Fac Id: 71905Federal Communications Commission Washington, D.C. 20554April 29, 2020This is in reference to your April 27, 2020 request seeking special temporary authority (STA) to operate TV station WNLO, Buffalo, NY, on its authorized channel using an interim antenna with alternate parameters while the station’s main facility is built-out and made operational.After a thorough review of your technical specifications, we are persuaded that no interference is likely to occur from the proposed operation. We therefore conclude that the public interest would be served by the grant of this request. If problems do arise, we expect them to be solved expeditiously and the Bureau reserves the right to require the termination of the operation.With respect to radio frequency radiation (RFR), we expect compliance with Section 1.1307(b) of the Commission’s Rules to be achieved.In light of the above, special temporary authority IS GRANTED pursuant to Section 73.1560(d) and 73.1635 of the Commission’s Rules. This authorization expires on October 29, 2020.Sincerely,/s/Kevin R. HardingDeputy Chief, Video Division Media Bureau

Last edited by tvguy (April 30, 2020 4:40 pm)

 

April 30, 2020 4:47 pm  #26


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Which certainly continues to explain why I've completely lost both WIVB and WNLO over my antenna in Toronto. They haven't come in for over a month or more and I suspect I can't be the only one who's having this issue. Hopefully, they'll be able to complete this sooner than later and CBS and the CW will be back. Although with all TV production on hiatus, there likely won't be much new to watch on them in the near future anyway.  

     Thread Starter
 

April 30, 2020 4:53 pm  #27


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

thanks for the updates tvguy!  I have not lost these channels so I assume signal strength will only get stronger after.  Im in Etobicoke.  

 

May 1, 2020 6:32 am  #28


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

markow202 wrote:

thanks for the updates tvguy!  I have not lost these channels so I assume signal strength will only get stronger after.  Im in Etobicoke.  

With RA residing in "Northern" North York and no WIVB, I guess location, location, location is everything now.

 

May 1, 2020 7:02 am  #29


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

mace wrote:

markow202 wrote:

thanks for the updates tvguy!  I have not lost these channels so I assume signal strength will only get stronger after.  Im in Etobicoke.  

With RA residing in "Northern" North York and no WIVB, I guess location, location, location is everything now.

Well I wasn't planning to head to Etobicoke but if reception is better there, maybe I should consider it!

Actually, if I do ever buy another place, I want to move to 123 Teston Rd. Why that specific address? Because as an old radio guy, when someone asks me where I live, I want to honestly be able to answer, "Teston. Teston. 1-2-3 Teston..."

     Thread Starter
 

May 1, 2020 10:13 am  #30


Re: Exactly One Month To Go Before Final Buffalo OTA Stations Repack

Well im in central etobicoke (kipling near eglinton) and appears the height of land, no building obstructions nearby plus a 3rd floor height facing south seems to help.  In the distance level by eye, my DB4E antenna is height rooftop level to the new condos to palace pier/parklawn area lakeshore that I see from afar (if it works that way).