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October 28, 2020 11:22 pm  #31


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

O'Toole answered the question very well and many would not have too much to disagree about what he said.  However CBC funding isn't really a big issue or top of mind for most Canadians. Mind you Post Media and Quebecor have  been trying hard for 20 years but for very self serving reasons.
 
We talked about this clip a few months ago and the tape played was from O'Tooles own recording.  As you know high level politicians usually record any interviews on their own.  So CBC would know this would be released whether it was cut or not from The House.

It looks a little suspect agreed but I think again CBC was trying to not be part of the leadership campaign and would likely get criticized for making it all about them if they ran the clip as the final question of the interview.   I am sure Sun/Post Media would then accuse them of trying to whip up listener support for CBC funding.

The real time for all of this will be during the next election campaign where I am sure everyone will be covering this story if warranted. Still I wouldn't be surprised if CBC doesn't cover this as much as competing media if it becomes a major story. 

Actually I was mistaken, what O'Toole is proposing would only save $350 to $400 million per year after five years of phasing in for the 50% reduction of CBC TV.   A bit of money, but chump change considering the $350 billion dollar deficit this year. 

He said he would be leaving Radio Canada TV, Radio and I would think the northern services alone.  He wants to cut CBC News Network as well but it is self sustaining from advertising and cable fees and CBC.ca actually does well advertising wise.  I know he doesn't like this but they do have the numbers and blow other news websites out of the water in terms of viewership.  Basically it is only CBC English TV that has lousy ratings.

 

October 29, 2020 8:14 pm  #32


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

paterson1 wrote:

Basically it is only CBC English TV that has lousy ratings.

As if to prove your point:

No breakout hits among CBC’s new shows so far this season

But at least they can point to this:

CBC's "The Trickster" Picked Up By The CW In U.S.  

     Thread Starter
 

October 30, 2020 9:00 am  #33


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

A number of well known ex-CBC names aren't happy with a new idea from the Corp. Among them: Peter Mansbridge, Linden MacIntyre, Gillian Findlay, Bob McKeown and Adrienne Clarkson.

From the Globe & Mail (not behind a paywall.)

Current, former CBC employees condemn corporation’s branded-content initiative

     Thread Starter
 

October 30, 2020 10:46 am  #34


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

One of the scenario's for CBC english TV could be something that not many are really thinking about.  If government funds for the english network do get cut back, there is a chance that CBC TV will become very commercial.  They will be looking at ways to increase ad revenue which has been sliding badly with the loss of hockey and less than stellar ratings for most shows.

I believe that CBC TV should compete more directly with CTV and Global for ratings, similar what they did with some success in the late 80's and early 90's. I don't mean competing with the importation of US programming, but offer more mainstream or popular programming on their schedule.

The CBC haters love to gripe about Family Feud Canada.  Name me one game show that CTV, City or Global is producing, or has produced in the last couple of years?  This show is off to a slower start so far, but I bet you in a few weeks it will be in the top 30. 

This is one reason why Radio Canada is much more popular and sells more advertising than CBC TV.  They compete directly with TVA,  all of the french private stations and streaming services with success.

The Numeris ratings from  two weeks ago showed Radio Canada with 8 of the top 10 shows in Quebec and half of the top 30.  I can see why former separatist politician and Quebecor CEO Pierre Peladeau hates Radio Canada so much.  TVA does well with local productions but also carries a fair bit of imported US programming too.

CBC could very well partner up more with private companies for movies or TV drama, similar to what CTV and Global do and co-produce programming.  They have dabbled in this with Disney and a few others but never in a big way. 

The CRTC might never let it happen, and CBC radio's rather elite listeners would hit the roof, but CBC radio one would do well in the advertising game.  They have the exact listeners in big numbers that high end advertisers want.  All the luxury car makers would advertise on CBC radio one in a heartbeat, and would pay top dollar for airtime.  Same with retailers such as Chanel, Hermes, Holt Renfrew, Simons and many others.

Any advertising would likely need to be exclusive and limited with the ability to target different markets in commercial breaks. Private broadcasters wouldn't be happy but if CBC radio were to target advertisers that the private stations aren't getting anyway, what difference does it make?  This could bring in major money for CBC but naturally there also a risk with this. 

Advertising was tried a few years ago on CBC two, now CBC Music, but this was not the service that advertisers really wanted back then.   Since the format change to CBC Music two years ago, the network has seen marked improvement in ratings, but for now radio one would be much more successful for advertising revenue.

 

October 30, 2020 11:19 am  #35


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

paterson1 wrote:

The CRTC might never let it happen, and CBC radio's rather elite listeners would hit the roof, but CBC radio one would do well in the advertising game.  They have the exact listeners in big numbers that high end advertisers want.  All the luxury car makers would advertise on CBC radio one in a heartbeat, and would pay top dollar for airtime.  Same with retailers such as Chanel, Hermes, Holt Renfrew, Simons and many others.

Believe it or not, I was just thinking about this the other day. And I believe one of the reasons (but obviously, not the only reason) that CBC Radio 1 is always near the top of the ratings in so many Canadian markets is precisely because it doesn’t air commercials.
 
And I can only use a recent example that I experienced that helped further convince me of this.
 
A few days ago, I woke up at 5:30 AM and turned on the radio when I had trouble getting back to sleep. I listened to CFRB’s half hour newscast to get a quick update about what happened overnight and then lay back in kind of a semi-dozing state. I could follow the station. but I wasn’t fully conscious. I think we’ve all been there at some point early in the morning, sort of half-awake. (Some might say I’m in that state all day long!)
 
After the news, they went into a spot break. It started with one commercial. Then another. Then another. And another. And on and on and on it went. Just when I thought they couldn’t possibly run any more of them, they did. By this point, I was getting so aggravated, it actually woke me up fully, and I turned over and reached for the radio and changed the station in disgust.
 
Look, good for ’RB that they can attract that many advertisers. But to run four-to-six minutes of spots in a row is a huge disservice to their audience and it’s a gigantic tune-out. And because every single commercial station seems to work in quarter hours, they all go to their ad breaks at almost the exact same time, a situation that’s driven me crazy for years. (I wonder how many ears one of them might attract if they went early to their spot breaks, only to be back on air with programming while their competition is endlessly selling something.)
 
When this happens, I find sometimes myself going to the CBC by default for a few minutes, only to escape the non-stop shilling. I don’t stay but some might. I would be really, really curious to see what would happen if CBC Radio ever did start airing commercials like their private counterparts – no matter what the products were. I can’t prove it, but I think you’d see the ratings slip – even if they are using taxpayer money to hire six producers for each show, which no private station could afford.

     Thread Starter
 

October 30, 2020 4:32 pm  #36


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

Lack of commercials could be a minor factor.  Although I kind of find it hard to believe that great numbers of people hate radio ads that much.  How do they react to other content on air they don't like or want to hear? 

Interesting to note that  radio actually did run commercials until the mid 70's.  It was in 1974 CBC radio dropped advertising.  Many people forgot or didn't know this.

Usually I don't find advertising a turnoff on talk stations, and normally ads are spaced out logically between features.  Talk radio ads or breaks don't seem overly intrusive or long to me at least. 

That's one reason why I think that Canadian commercial radio is superior in some ways than US commercial radio.   All US stations regardless of format seem to have huge long commercial breaks all day long.  And the audio quality of national ads sometimes is quite poor, sounding like it has been fed from satellite with layer upon layer of equalization, or we are listening to the 30th generation of the ad.    

Personally I find TV commercial clusters much more annoying than most radio. The only exception would be hit music oriented stations that  tend to have long commercial/promo breaks which are a turn off.

Do people really care if a station plays six or seven songs in a row rather than 10?  And would your ratings be decimated if you had one more commercial break per hour and made all breaks a couple of minutes shorter?

Runnings ads would be a risk for CBC radio but the breaks would be nothing like commercial radio, not as frequent or long.  Also it could give CBC TV more exposure on the radio networks where they are not given much promotion now.   Bell, Corus and Rogers all have a bunch of  radio stations to promote their prime time TV programming all day long. 

Six producers per show?  Little exaggeration there RA?  Maybe As it Happens and the morning show but  hardly each show.  CBC television programs don't even have six producers per show, so doubtful radio would. 

 

 

October 30, 2020 4:52 pm  #37


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

paterson1 wrote:

Lack of commercials could be a minor factor.  Although I kind of find it hard to believe that great numbers of people hate radio ads that much.  How do they react to other content on air they don't like or want to hear? 

When they go on for over five minutes or more, I maintain any station becomes unlistenable. I sometimes sit there after the fifth or sixth spot (if I'm still tuned in by then, which I rarely am) and say, "They wouldn't dare air yet another commercial!" And then, sure enough, that's exactly what happens. Do they realize how easy it is to change the station with today's radios? Sheesh. It's a real insult to listeners.  

paterson1 wrote:

Usually I don't find advertising a turnoff on talk stations, and normally ads are spaced out logically between features.  Talk radio ads or breaks don't seem overly intrusive or long to me at least. 

We must be listening to different stations! Although a lot depends on the daypart. 

paterson1 wrote:

Personally I find TV commercial clusters much more annoying than most radio.

Can't argue with that. It's why I DVR almost everything except news. 

paterson1 wrote:

Do people really care if a station plays six or seven songs in a row rather than 10?

All I'm saying is I'd love to see what would happen to CBC Radio's ratings if they had the same spot load. Maybe nothing, but maybe tune-out. Would they still be #1 in the mornings? 

And by the way, the only time CBC Radio ever has to air spots now is during a federal election. Under the law, they are required to air commercials for the various party candidates, should they choose to advertise on their airwaves.  

paterson1 wrote:

Six producers per show?  Little exaggeration there RA?  Maybe As it Happens and the morning show but  hardly each show.

Try listening to the credit roll at the end of one of CBC's radio shows. It often takes more than 90 secs. to list them all. If not six people, then maybe four.

And perhaps they're not all credited as "producers." Instead listen for coordinators, writers, technical producers, directors, etc. etc. You'll never hear a list that long in private radio unless it's some colossal special months in the making. And even then.

I know. I used to produce a two-hour nationally syndicated weekly show across Canada out of a private Toronto radio station. The credits at the end were me and one other guy. That's it. Somehow we got those shows on the air with just the two of us. It was a ton of work and there were some 12 hour days, but we did it. 

Check out the list after "The House" or "Day Six" on Saturday mornings. Or "The Debaters." What do all those people do for a half hour comedy show in which three people sit and talk for 30 minutes?  It's a tote about bloat.   

     Thread Starter
 

October 30, 2020 6:35 pm  #38


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

Most of my talk radio listening would be in and around  mid morning/mid afternoon.  I listen to 570 News/CHML/Newstalk 1010 and AM 640.  Music radio is all FM/streaming/Sirius XM and at anytime really. 

So especially on the talk stations, can't say I have noticed 5 minute clusters of only commercials/promo. Maybe 5 minutes if traffic and weather or a news update is included in the break.

If CBC radio had the same load of commercials as Newstalk 1010 guaranteed they would lose audience and a lot of people would be upset.  But this isn't really what I was talking about.  CBC radio would have a totally different presentation of the ads and not nearly the number of commercials.  AM radio like 1010 or 640 technically have no limit on commercial time.

A lot of people, especially many CBC listeners wouldn't initially like the idea of advertising.  However handled and promoted correctly, and with a low commercial load (4-6 minutes per hour) it really wouldn't do any harm to ratings and especially if the ads were not heard elsewhere.  

If CBC were smart, they should use their network stations to their advantage and allow "local, regional or national" options for advertisers during commercial breaks.  Possibly only allow ads during morning and afternoon drive programs at first.  

CBC radio one has the audience, the demographics, incomes and loyalty that advertisers want..  They could charge top rates and would be be somewhat in the driver's seat since they would have very limited minutes available to sell.

Some of the people on credits you hear at the end of a CBC program work on more than one show.  So the list of names heard at the end of a half hour comedy show are usually working on other programs too.  Notice the end credits on Cross Country Check Up they will start off with "this week Check Up was produced by...  or our technician this week was..."  They can and do bounce people around depending on the show.

 

Last edited by paterson1 (October 30, 2020 6:37 pm)

 

October 30, 2020 7:05 pm  #39


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

Many keep the dial at CBC radio, w/o exception, because of no annoying commercial clusters.   If CBC starts fucquing around with that, it could easily lose what support it has for its +$1 billion annual subsidy (admitedly incl. TV).     

No? 

 

October 30, 2020 11:28 pm  #40


Re: CBC May Get Extra $34 Million In "COVID-Related" Funding

I don't listen to CFRB because of this reason.  As soon as a conversation gets interesting a four minute island comes up.  No thanks.