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May 28, 2015 12:14 pm  #1


Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

(Via Hamilton Spectator)

Hamilton's media world will move into a new universe Thursday afternoon when it's announced that the city will be getting its first all-sports radio station.

The Spectator has learned that the Hamilton Tiger-Cats are partnering with an as-yet-unnamed media group in establishing the new station and that the partnership will be made public Thursday.

"I have no comment," Ticats chief executive Scott Mitchell said late Wednesday afternoon.

While the identity of the Ticats' partner is not known, it almost certainly has to be TSN, which is owned by Bell Media. It also owns Hamilton radio stations Funny 820 and CKOC, and is the sole TV broadcast partner of the Canadian Football League.

It is not likely the team would invest in such a major partnership with any competitor — such as Sportsnet — of TSN, the national all-sports network that has helped to completely change, for the positive, the financial fortunes of the CFL over the past decade.

TSN has all-sports stations in several major Canadian cities, and some of them hold them hold the broadcast rights for the local CFL team. Last week, TSN's parent company, Bell Media, and Toronto businessman Larry Tanenbaum bought the Argonauts from Hamilton's David Braley. Their games were already being broadcast on TSN's Toronto radio station.

More...  http://www.thespec.com/news-story/5649144-hamilton-getting-all-sports-radio-station/
 


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May 28, 2015 3:31 pm  #2


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

All Sports Radio lands in Hamilton
(Via CBC)

The Hamilton Tiger-Cats are moving up the AM dial and onto the new, all-sports TSN Radio, as Bell and TSN take over CKOC 1150 in Hamilton.

The former oldies radio station will play all Ticats game leading up to the format shifts from "classic hits" to become Hamilton's first all-sports talk radio in the fall. Leading up to the official rebranding, CKOC will carry Ticats game broadcasts, including preseason beginning June 8.

"This partnership of three great brands, the Hamilton Tiger-Cats, Bell and TSN, will provide an unprecedented radio and multiple media platform that will further strengthen the strong Ticats presence in markets throughout the region," Scott Mitchell, Hamilton Tiger-Cats CEO, said in a press release. "TSN Radio 1150 Hamilton will be the voice of our team as well as of our fans. This is game-changing news for everybody in TigerTown."

Ticats games were previously aired on CHML 900, owned by Corus Entertainment and Shaw Communications. Ticats spokesperson Josh Lashway confirmed the news of TSN Radio ended the team's relationship with CHML.

Hamilton will be the seventh Canadian city for TSN Radio, joining Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa, Vancouver, Winnipeg, and Edmonton.

Live broadcasts of the Toronto Maple Leafs and Toronto Raptors will also be aired on the new station.

In 2013, the Canadian Football League signed a TV, radio and digital deal with TSN worth a reported $40-million a year, one that extends until the end of the 2018 season.

TSN Radio national program director Robert Gray said in a release: "We are thrilled to announce this new expansion of TSN Radio, which now allows us to deliver the trusted news and analysis that fans have come to expect from TSN."

TSN Radio now has coverage of five CFL teams on their own all-sports stations, including the Hamilton Tiger-Cats, Toronto Argonauts, Montreal Alouettes, Ottawa Redblacks and B.C. Lions.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/all-sports-tsn-radio-lands-in-hamilton-new-ticats-broadcaster-1.3091537
 


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     Thread Starter
 

May 28, 2015 9:36 pm  #3


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

And so ends the era of classic hits on AM in the region, unless you can get CKDO or CJOY clearly. I'd like to know what the impetus was for the decision to go with 1150 and not 820, both Bell properties in Hamilton. While I admit I haven't really listened to CKOC in a while (especially not with their recent nighttime power reduction) and I like Funny 820 as as a stopgap in the car when there's nothing else to listen to, the ratings from last fall show the oldies hitting almost a 5 locally, with the comedy sitting at a 1.0.

So why do you think did Bell picked CKOC to be the one that becomes all sports? I'm also curious about the need for such a station in that market. Beyond the Ti-Cats, which I'm told is something of a religion in the Hammer, and the Bulldogs, what other local major sports are there to keep the conversation going? After all, there's already plenty of Blue Jays, Leafs talk etc. emanating from 1050 (and 590) that residents there can hear without any problem. And I believe 820 has a better signal overall.

Not trying to be a snob about this, cause I like Hamillton, but I'm truly wondering about the choices Bell made and why they were made. Perhaps it was more a comment on the perceived futility of music on that band than anything else.     

Meanwhile, if I were AM 740, I'd consider tweaking the format to pick up whatever listeners will defect when the new format comes into full effect in the fall.

Last edited by RadioActive (May 28, 2015 9:40 pm)

 

May 28, 2015 10:43 pm  #4


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Thank-you RadioActive. 
I was wondering the same thing. 
How does All comedy make more money than classic hits/oldies?
When Funny 820 came to be it was because there was no further logic in competing with FM Country.
Now they won't even bother to switch 820 over to classic hits/oldies.

It sounds to me like Bell would rather spend $5 to make $6 (if that) than to spend $500 to make $600. 
(as the old saying goes...)

Such a shame. 


 

 

May 29, 2015 7:30 am  #5


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Radiowiz wrote:

It sounds to me like Bell would rather spend $5 to make $6 (if that) than to spend $500 to make $600.  

Far from just Bell.  That's the reality of many radio formats depending on the money guy looking at them.  

You're right.  Just about all radio companies would rather spend $5 million to make $7, rather than $15 million to make $17 because the cost of carrying that extra $10 mil has to be factored into the budgets.  You're not really making close to the $2 million profit on paper you would be in a $5/$7 scenario.   So your format must be able to justify not just the audience, but the audience and advertisers that will fiscally support it.   It's one thing to get a 1 or 2 share in Toronto, but it's not worth it if it can't survive financially.  It's not public broadcasting, and it's not fair that it should be measured as such.

Sales guys are truly the unsung heros in a lot of these formats.  A thousand years ago, when I was at 640, and to much the same extend 680, made crazy numbers over what they should do based on ratings.  That income is based on an awesome sales force working with the on-air talent selling retail on the streets to advertisers who can see past numbers to tangible results in their places of business.  There's a real relationship that develops between the advertisers and the sales / on-air people.  

It can be a difficult thing for someone not directly involved in the relationship to comprehend, but it's the Sauls, Toms, Franks and Michael's that allow some of these formats to remain viable.  


 


Madness takes its toll.  Please have exact change.
 
     Thread Starter
 

May 29, 2015 8:04 am  #6


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

One wonders if they will give CKOC's music format a proper send-off. After all, they've been either a Top 40 or an oldies outlet continuously since October 3, 1960. More likely it will just fade into the ether in the middle of the night like CHUM, with no acknowledgment of the more than half-century of history.


"The radio craze ... will soo fade." - Thomas Edison, 1922
 

May 29, 2015 9:05 am  #7


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

At least CHUM had quite a few 'goodbye' events, including the long lead up to the 2001 switch to The Team.  
Then there was the 50th anniversary open house in 2007 and the year long celebration of the 50th.  And then came the final one in November '07 or '08 (I forget) which was another open house.  During 2007, we produced hundreds of celebratory messages, short airchecks segments, fun promos, etc.

A lot of that happened while CHUM was still owned by the Waters family and then after 2006, CTV supported the 50th in 2007 (although CTV management probably didn't even know or care what was happening since they had secret plans of their own for 1050 which included pulling the plug on oldies and plugging in CP24 audio until TSN 1050 arrived.

I sincerely hope Bell's radio brain trust puts together some kind of celebration of CKOC's legacy.  It would be a really nice gesture to their listeners...but I'm not holding my breath.  

Last edited by Doug Thompson (May 29, 2015 9:07 am)

 

May 29, 2015 9:20 am  #8


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

The CHUM goodbyes were wonderful, in fact in my listening experience it was the best and most extended farewell I've ever heard for a radio station. Classy. They spared no effort. By the time 2009 rolled around, the Waters family of course was far removed from proceedings hence the lack of a proper goodbye from Bell (which doesn't excuse their corporate indifference but that's for another thread).

I agree with you Doug that Bell should put together a nice celebration of CKOC, but probably won't. These big corporations just don't care about history just the bottom line.


"The radio craze ... will soo fade." - Thomas Edison, 1922
 

May 29, 2015 10:31 am  #9


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Dale Patterson wrote:

I agree with you Doug that Bell should put together a nice celebration of CKOC,

Just what I was thinking. They should bring in John Novak to do a noon time countdown like he used to and Nevin Grant for a few ``In Touch With Yesterday.``
 

Last edited by Fitz (May 29, 2015 10:40 am)


Cool Airchecks and More:
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May 29, 2015 10:54 am  #10


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Longtime CKOC PD Nevin Grant has a treasure trove of CKOC memorabilia.  Roger Ashby was an 'OC alum and since CHUM FM is also Bell, he could be a part of the wrap up.  Gord James is currently doing imaging for 'OC so he'd be available (even though he moved to one of the Carolinas).  Don't know if Ted Yates is on this board yet, but I'll bet he'd be happy to participate.  

But as I said before, it probably won't happen.  

 

May 29, 2015 3:40 pm  #11


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

I wonder how much local programming they will have on TSN 1150. Maybe Doug Farroway will make a comeback.

 

May 30, 2015 9:22 pm  #12


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

So does this mean that the Leaf games will move from 820 to 1150 when the format flip becomes official? If so, that may be one of the saving graces of losing the last decent fulltime oldies signal in the GTA. I never thought the Leafs belonged on an all comedy station, although some here could successfully argue that's exactly where they should be! In any event, as a not-really-hockey fan (can I say that and still keep my Canadain citizenship?) I always hated it when the Leafs took away Funny 820 for hours - mainly because it was the only place left to go when the Toronto team seemed to be occupying every other channel on the AM dial. 

By the way, has anyone else completely lost CKOC's signal at night? I recall posting a note to the old SOWNY board about them being granted a power decrease by the CRTC, but I was under the impression from the filing (http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2014/2014-565.htm) that they would still be putting a decent signal into Toronto, and only the fringes would be affected. As it stands now, it appears there's no signal to get anymore. Which means if they do manage to do a farewell, most of us will have to listen to the end of it over the web. 

Last edited by RadioActive (May 30, 2015 9:29 pm)

 

May 30, 2015 9:51 pm  #13


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

RadioActive wrote:

So does this mean that the Leaf games will move from 820 to 1150 when the format flip becomes official?

While the answer is yes, keep on mind that maybe 820 is the spare frequency that will now carry a game when 1150 is already carrying a major game at the same time. (just a thought...)
 

 

May 30, 2015 11:20 pm  #14


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Much like in television, live sports is one of the few types of content that can't be experienced via time shifting and whatnot. Oldies? Plenty of other ways to get them, without ad content. Like it or not, it strikes me as sound business decision.

 

May 31, 2015 9:29 am  #15


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

verger wrote:

Much like in television, live sports is one of the few types of content that can't be experienced via time shifting and whatnot. Oldies? Plenty of other ways to get them, without ad content. Like it or not, it strikes me as sound business decision.

You can say that about all music radio.
The difference is that radio in Hamilton can offer a local feeling. Oldies/classic hits with a local feeling is always good.
820, done right, can make more money with classic hits/oldies than it can with all comedy radio.

Let's all be thankful AM 740 is in the hands of a smaller company and not one of the big guys. otherwise it too would end up being some sort of sports or news/talk dumping ground.
Interesting how standards is still considered to be more profitable than oldies or classic hits though...at least to Moses & company...
 

 

May 31, 2015 10:12 am  #16


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Yes, but oldies done right - and not as jukebox - can also be successful. Freddy Vette has done extrremely well with his afternoon drive '50s-'60s show on CJBQ, What originally started as a two-hour weekday show in 2009 is now a five-hour extravaganza every afternoon from 2-7 p.m. Freddy does it with personality, listener call-ins, a deep playlist and a retro sound that sounds like radio back in the day. It just shows what can be done with creativity and imagination.


"The radio craze ... will soo fade." - Thomas Edison, 1922
 

May 31, 2015 11:20 am  #17


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

To me, AM740 sounds very old.  Moses is actually using the 'block programming' format - ie. something for everyone.  An up beat, informative morning show (called "The Happy Gang", a rip off of the name of a CBC radio program that aired from 1937 until 1959), followed by a two hour talk show, aimed at (or so it seems to me) the really senior audience.  Then Norm Edwards plays 40's/50's/60's/70's and contemporary AC music until Robbie Lane takes us back to "The 60's at 6", "The 70's at 7" etc.  From 10 to 11PM, AM740 airs old time radio programs from the 1930's to the 1950's (and I must admit, I do enjoy listening to those).

But things really haven't changed much on AM740 for years.  How long can something be called 'New'?
And in my opinion, their jingles are the hokiest sounding things ever.  They're obviously recorded in Canada.  As amazing as Canada's creative community was and is, we never quite got the 'hang' of creating great sound radio station singing jingles.

For all of the Canadian radio stations I created jingles for, I went to the source - hired an arranger in Dallas, flew there and worked with the regular session musicians and jingle singers that did WABC, KFWB, WLS, KBOX etc. Bobby Curtola and his songwriting partners, Basil & Dyer Hurdon did the same thing.  They recorded in Nashville using the same session players everyone else used.  Bobby told me that he often had Floyd Cramer on piano, Grady Martin and Harold Bradley on guitar, Bob Moore on bass plus the Anita Kerr Singers and occasionally (when they were available) The Jordanaires, Elvis' back up singing group.  

It's possible that Moses likes his station sounding 'hokey'...but for me (I'm a first wave Boomer/Zoomer), I'm not really interested in listening to Glenn Miller and Hugo Winterhalter & His Orchestra.  Growing up listening to CHUM (first as a teenager, then as a staff member from 1965), that's not my music.  That's my parents generation of music.

AM740 listeners are literally dieing off.  I believe the station needs to change and relatively soon to attract a slightly younger audience.  I doubt he'll ever get the Millennial to listen simply because they don't go to AM radio much (unless it's news or sports, mainly sports), but there are plenty of Boomers/Zoomers to give him a comfortable ratings boost if he chooses to 'modernize'  

Last edited by Doug Thompson (May 31, 2015 11:24 am)

 

May 31, 2015 11:24 am  #18


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Dale Patterson wrote:

Yes, but oldies done right - and not as jukebox - can also be successful. Freddy Vette has done extrremely well with his afternoon drive '50s-'60s show on CJBQ, What originally started as a two-hour weekday show in 2009 is now a five-hour extravaganza every afternoon from 2-7 p.m. Freddy does it with personality, listener call-ins, a deep playlist and a retro sound that sounds like radio back in the day. It just shows what can be done with creativity and imagination.

Will have to tune into CJBQ.

Micheal Godin's Tresure Island Oldiies I think re-creates the original Top 40 Vibe very well and he's been streaming for years and has a few affiliates carrying him. Small and independent and live every Sunday night.


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May 31, 2015 12:45 pm  #19


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Doug Thompson wrote:

To me, AM740 sounds very old.  Moses is actually using the 'block programming' format - ie. something for everyone.  An up beat, informative morning show (called "The Happy Gang", a rip off of the name of a CBC radio program that aired from 1937 until 1959), followed by a two hour talk show, aimed at (or so it seems to me) the really senior audience.  Then Norm Edwards plays 40's/50's/60's/70's and contemporary AC music until Robbie Lane takes us back to "The 60's at 6", "The 70's at 7" etc.  From 10 to 11PM, AM740 airs old time radio programs from the 1930's to the 1950's (and I must admit, I do enjoy listening to those).

But things really haven't changed much on AM740 for years.  How long can something be called 'New'?
And in my opinion, their jingles are the hokiest sounding things ever.  They're obviously recorded in Canada.  As amazing as Canada's creative community was and is, we never quite got the 'hang' of creating great sound radio station singing jingles.

For all of the Canadian radio stations I created jingles for, I went to the source - hired an arranger in Dallas, flew there and worked with the regular session musicians and jingle singers that did WABC, KFWB, WLS, KBOX etc. Bobby Curtola and his songwriting partners, Basil & Dyer Hurdon did the same thing.  They recorded in Nashville using the same session players everyone else used.  Bobby told me that he often had Floyd Cramer on piano, Grady Martin and Harold Bradley on guitar, Bob Moore on bass plus the Anita Kerr Singers and occasionally (when they were available) The Jordanaires, Elvis' back up singing group.  

It's possible that Moses likes his station sounding 'hokey'...but for me (I'm a first wave Boomer/Zoomer), I'm not really interested in listening to Glenn Miller and Hugo Winterhalter & His Orchestra.  Growing up listening to CHUM (first as a teenager, then as a staff member from 1965), that's not my music.  That's my parents generation of music.

AM740 listeners are literally dieing off.  I believe the station needs to change and relatively soon to attract a slightly younger audience.  I doubt he'll ever get the Millennial to listen simply because they don't go to AM radio much (unless it's news or sports, mainly sports), but there are plenty of Boomers/Zoomers to give him a comfortable ratings boost if he chooses to 'modernize'  

AM 740 has gone downhill ever since Moses took over. Worst jingles I've heard anywhere, bar none. A talk show in the middle of the day, right into the lunch hour - are you kidding me? The morning show is OK now that Gallagher's gone but for a while there is was unlistenable. Norm Edwards gives them continuity with the AM 1250 days but do listeners really care about that? I've never been a fan of Robbie Lane, sorry - I find him almost painful to listen to (I wish Frank Proctor still had that shift). I do like the music AM 740 plays for the most part - the playlist is pretty wide and diverse - but the tuneout factor for me is what I hear between the songs including those damned jingles.
 

Last edited by Dale Patterson (May 31, 2015 12:46 pm)


"The radio craze ... will soo fade." - Thomas Edison, 1922
 

May 31, 2015 1:16 pm  #20


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

AM740 is just too 'old and tired' sounding.  1050 CHUM had a talk show in the morning in the late '60's well into the '70's first with Larry Solway, then John Gilbert and those shows, for the most part, was interesting because Larry and John were entertainers first.  

People's taste in announcers is different of course, but I do like Robbie Lane.  I think he's become an excellent broadcaster, plus he knows his '60's and '70's music since he was in the middle of it here in Canada.

Maybe Moses will read this Dale and hire you and I to 'fix' AM740.  Resumes upon request.  

 

May 31, 2015 1:22 pm  #21


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

AM740 aside for the moment, it really would be nice for Bell to give CKOC a final send off as a music station (maybe not as elaborate as we did at CHUM), but it certainly would be the cool thing to do.
Perhaps someone in Bell Media (now that Kevin Crull is gone) will actually try and organize something.  It wouldn't cost very much and I'll bet plenty of the old gang would be happy to get involved.  

We did CHUM's 50th anniversary on a song and a prayer.  NO MONEY whatsoever.  All a labour of love from everyone involved.
 

 

May 31, 2015 2:17 pm  #22


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

The CKOC send off would be nice, but it's a one time hit that would probably be missed by most.  It would be good for someone to create a site much like Doug has done for CHUM with pictures, memories, contributions etc.  Something that would keep on 'living' rather than just being a few hours long.
 


Madness takes its toll.  Please have exact change.
 
     Thread Starter
 

May 31, 2015 2:42 pm  #23


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

First, so good to see you and Dale back again posting here.  I think this bodes well.  (fingers crossed)

Doug Thompson wrote:

AM740 is just too 'old and tired' sounding.  1050 CHUM had a talk show in the morning in the late '60's well into the '70's first with Larry Solway, then John Gilbert and those shows, for the most part, was interesting because Larry and John were entertainers first.  

People's taste in announcers is different of course, but I do like Robbie Lane.  I think he's become an excellent broadcaster, plus he knows his '60's and '70's music since he was in the middle of it here in Canada.

Maybe Moses will read this Dale and hire you and I to 'fix' AM740.  Resumes upon request.  

I rather enjoy Robbie Lane as well especially for the insights he gives about a song/artist he had some involvement with.  That's the kind of thing I like to listen to.  It's one of the reasons I hang out here -- I want to hear the stories/

I listen to Stafford so I don't usually listen to AM740's talk at noon.  But the few times I've tried to listen when Stafford wasn't on, it wound up being very brief creating a bounceback to 640 for whoever was on.
 

 

May 31, 2015 4:48 pm  #24


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

RadioActive wrote:

So why do you think did Bell picked CKOC to be the one that becomes all sports?

In my opinion, Bell from a sports persective is trying to catch up to Rogers who understand that unique programming is what counts.  Sports media is special, timely and can be monopolized (like Rogers and their NHL deal).  Whether it's profitable is a question to be answered. 
 


- Not an industry person.  Just a guy with a love of Toronto radio. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/cute.gif
 

May 31, 2015 6:51 pm  #25


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

ig wrote:

The CKOC send off would be nice, but it's a one time hit that would probably be missed by most.  It would be good for someone to create a site much like Doug has done for CHUM with pictures, memories, contributions etc.  Something that would keep on 'living' rather than just being a few hours long.
 

 This is as close as I can find for the moment.

http://www.ckoc1150archives.com/index.html

 

June 4, 2015 10:52 pm  #26


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

I just heard that CKTB in St. Catharines will also be carrying all the Ti-Cat games starting June 8th. If you're actually changing a station's format to all sports, and that same station can be easily received in the Niagara area market, why do you need two outlets carrying the exact same thing just a relatively small number of kilometres apart? Do the Ti-Cats have a huge following in St. Kitts? Same thing with the Leafs. Do we really need them on The Fan 590, TSN 1050, CKTB 610 and Funny 820 (switching to TSN 1150 in the fall)? Talk about overkill. 

 

June 5, 2015 7:25 am  #27


Re: Hamilton getting all-sports radio station

Damn!  I didn't listen to 1150 that often, but it was nice to have a button to push if I was just sick of the same topics being re-hashed late in the day on 1010 and 640, or on weekends when the landscape is nothing but infommercials and reruns.  I certainly will never tune in to yet another sports station, especially one based in Hamilton (with all due respect to the Hammer).  As for 740, no thanks.  My parents listen to that station, and they're in their 80s...

Last edited by Charlie (June 5, 2015 7:28 am)